As you know, Trump started the Syrian war despite he ran his whole campaign against it. I endorsed him, so not seeing this betrayal is my fail too. The long post will come on Monday. For now, a short preview of my opinion about this turn of events.
Gelvin, I have to disagree with not seeing this coming. (Even a slight poke or provocation from another world power would of been enough to get Donald going) However, there is a bit too much doom and gloom regarding the end scenario here. I honestly think that the "mores coming" is more of a warning to Asad if he uses CW again. Plus he tipped off the Russians and this was more of save face/acting move to show that O's thin red line can be crossed, and well, you don't want to do that anymore. If anything, I appreciate the gesture, because even you got to admit that seeing dead children on tv make people act, sure it might not be smart, or logical to go after the bastard that did it, but it makes a statement for sure.
Will this get into regime change? I doubt it it. One airstrip is nothing, plus they moved most of what was there out more than likely. However, I think if Asad steps in it again and uses CW again, then there might be more lateral movement on the situation.
A lot of what i'm reading into the tea leaves is this is more or less a way to show TD is tough. However, he's reckless and emotional enough to get us all into a war that would be quite messy. I'm hoping his business side is more involved with this decision as a strategic gambit than anything else. That's my 2 cents.
Partisanship’s a helluva drug! Remember how Bill Clinton in the 90s went against 60 years of democratic policies and passed all the Reagan/GOP holy grails? (deregulation of banks and telecoms, NAFTA, welfare reform, law&order, wars, almost privatized SS, wars) But he was hip & cool, had a big blue D next to his name and he was relentlessly attacked by the repubs, so all the democrats rallied by him and elevated him to nearly sainthood, and it took 25 years for them to awaken from their drug induced coma.
Now it’s the right-wingers turn to take it. Trump was never the “chosen one” – he was always a fraud. This was obvious to anyone who wasn’t blinded by partisanship and bothered to actually look and think clearly: the string of bankruptcies and bad business decisions he made throughout his life, the way he consistently stiffed his contractors and workers, the obvious hypocrisy of railing against outsourcing and immigration while all his buildings were built with illegal immigrant labor and all his stuff is made in china, the way he said something different every 5 minutes, the way he talked like a 3rd grader without a hint of a deeper political philosophy, his incredibly thin skin and ego. More importantly, he was never against the establishment. He wanted to be the establishment, that’s why he tried to schmooze with all the donors. It was only when the donors rejected him (because they could see he was only a clown) that he stumbled on the “I’m against the establishment” strategy.
Everything was there. But he was also hip and cool, and relentlessly attacked by the other tribe, and he said all the right things your primitive brain wanted to hear, so you bought his shtick entirely. The tribal social ape think is strong with this one.
Yeah, I was ready to flip out as well when I heard the news that we had sent 59 cruise missiles into an air strip in Syria.
But then more details surfaced. Sure, a lot of buildings were destroyed, some planes (6 of them) were too, but they were dime a dozen MIG-23 types. Easily replaced. But the attack was specific, they didn't damage the runways at all.
And just one airfield. They can get that back up in a day... throw up a few temp buildings, fly in some spare planes, drive some trucks in... boom. Back in business.
Not only that, but the Russians were warned in advance.
This isn't the move of someone trying to overthrow a government. This is the strategic move of a negotiator saying "Ok, let's talk."
@gerfunkable: do you know of any evidence that Assad did the gas attack? Does gassing children worse than killing them with barrel bombs? Or "precision strikes": http://www.latimes.com/world/middleeast/la-fg-iraq-mosul-casualties-20170405-story.html
@Carson: what surprises me is that he had absolutely nothing to gain from this betrayal. He dragged himself to a war that he can't possibly win.
@Anon: Trump wasn't partisan. He was anything but a dime-a-dozen republican, he went head on with the holy free trade, holy cheap labor and above all: the sacred global interventionalism. I don't question that he fooled me, but it has nothing to do with being "Republican". I'd never endorse Cruz, Rubio or McCain. He himself designed a program that resonated with the people, different from Reps and Dems, just to be another mainstream nobody after elected.
Tradition demands that a US president launch cruise missiles more or less randomly sometime early in their first term. Syria dissed him, Melina's visiting, and this was easier on his heart than Viagra.
@Smokeman: no, it's a dealbreaker. He still considers himself the President of the World, despite his whole campaign was America First. HOW he manages it is irrelevant. He is a threat to anyone, everywhere, unless (see Monday post)
@Resivan: this is the problem. He is now a traditional US president. For that role, Clinton was the better option. Now we are stuck with an incompetent, bad-tempered Clinton. Wonderful!
He did not “design” anything. Trump is not capable of “designing”, he is a total fake clown. It was the people around him (mainly Bannon) who did the designing. Well, ok Trump is good at marketing and focus testing (you know this from Scott Adams). He is good at reading what people want to hear and then feeding that to them, then switching (you should watch the StarTrek Voyager episode called “Bliss” - “I see no sign of real intelligence, it seems to be operating on highly evolved instinct”). The program that "resonated" with the people was all lies (and ISK doubling scams) and it was easy to see right through it, if one can just remember the 190th rule of acquisition. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UW-0ClktvZI
Well, Trump obamas into a War... ...an illegal War this is... ...bypassing the UN and any international Law... ...welcome back "World Police" America? (I endorsed Trump because he might care about the big american problems, which have never been solveable by military)
Getting involved in the Syria war was pretty much inevitable, because if left unresolved the conflict will end in decades, rather than years, even if ISIS is dissolved or weakend. There were 2 options:
(a) Going into it 'opposing' Russia and allowing Turkey to become the 3rd wheel - the Hilary way (b) Going into it in 'agreement' (of sorts) with Russia and shoving Turkey to the side
Trump chose the second path, especially considering Erdogan's current stance against the west.
And they obviously had to intervene due to the Chemical weapons being used, because (a) they are illegal and (b) allowing them would create a precedent and further escalate conflict. It's kinda why no one uses nukes anymore; when the first trigger gets pressed then you are giving carte blanche to your opponents to use their arsenal as well.
@Tithian: the conflict not ending in decades does not threaten American interests. No ISIS fighter who have been in Syria could perform attack in the US.
It's unknown who used chemical weapons (might as well be CIA). It's not the job of any country to police genocides, it's the job of the UN Security Council. The US president has no more right to intervene in a genocide that does not threaten Americans than the president of Kongo or Chile.
@gelven im surprised your so worked up by this. But then I thought about it more after your first answer and realized why. TD is acting like a filthy social. Social pressure about CW was the reason why he acted. Your absolutely correct in stating that if assad bombed kids with conventional weapons no would care. Its the CW which got the world social pressure to get TD to act. However you hypothesis that TD is worse than C might be a tad off.
Well, Obama was also supposed to be the candidate of "hope and change" and anti-war, look how that worked out. (Coincidentally, he too beat Hillary in an election)
> Hillary was already horrible, things couldn't get worse.
That's privilege talking. Things probably weren't going to get much worse for white heterosexual native-born citizens in the middle class. You'd be hurt by cuts in benefits programs, but your income tax rate would probably fall also; the effects might cancel out. The same logic does *not* apply to everyone.
If you immigrated to the USA from Yemen? Trump victory makes your life worse.
Transgender kid in high school? Trump victory makes your life worse.
Working poor family which depends on PPACA-expanded Medicaid for little Timmy's asthma medicine? Trump victory makes your life worse.
Terminal cancer patient who wants the option of euthanasia instead of slowly wasting away under horrific pain? Trump victory makes your death worse.
Hillary took Saudi bribes into her foundation, so at least she got paid to push horrible policy. Trump is now doing it for free which is just plain stupid.
The thing most people misunderstood about Trump is that "Make America Great Again" didn't really mean any sort of economic greatness or cultural renaissance. It meant rebuilding and reinvigorating its capacity to dictate the course of development of other countries, through military means if necessary.
20 comments:
Gelvin, I have to disagree with not seeing this coming. (Even a slight poke or provocation from another world power would of been enough to get Donald going)
However, there is a bit too much doom and gloom regarding the end scenario here. I honestly think that the "mores coming" is more of a warning to Asad if he uses CW again. Plus he tipped off the Russians and this was more of save face/acting move to show that O's thin red line can be crossed, and well, you don't want to do that anymore. If anything, I appreciate the gesture, because even you got to admit that seeing dead children on tv make people act, sure it might not be smart, or logical to go after the bastard that did it, but it makes a statement for sure.
Will this get into regime change? I doubt it it. One airstrip is nothing, plus they moved most of what was there out more than likely. However, I think if Asad steps in it again and uses CW again, then there might be more lateral movement on the situation.
A lot of what i'm reading into the tea leaves is this is more or less a way to show TD is tough. However, he's reckless and emotional enough to get us all into a war that would be quite messy. I'm hoping his business side is more involved with this decision as a strategic gambit than anything else. That's my 2 cents.
He was always going to pull distractions out of his hat when the going got tough. Most politicians do. I can't believe that surprises you.
Partisanship’s a helluva drug! Remember how Bill Clinton in the 90s went against 60 years of democratic policies and passed all the Reagan/GOP holy grails? (deregulation of banks and telecoms, NAFTA, welfare reform, law&order, wars, almost privatized SS, wars) But he was hip & cool, had a big blue D next to his name and he was relentlessly attacked by the repubs, so all the democrats rallied by him and elevated him to nearly sainthood, and it took 25 years for them to awaken from their drug induced coma.
Now it’s the right-wingers turn to take it. Trump was never the “chosen one” – he was always a fraud. This was obvious to anyone who wasn’t blinded by partisanship and bothered to actually look and think clearly: the string of bankruptcies and bad business decisions he made throughout his life, the way he consistently stiffed his contractors and workers, the obvious hypocrisy of railing against outsourcing and immigration while all his buildings were built with illegal immigrant labor and all his stuff is made in china, the way he said something different every 5 minutes, the way he talked like a 3rd grader without a hint of a deeper political philosophy, his incredibly thin skin and ego. More importantly, he was never against the establishment. He wanted to be the establishment, that’s why he tried to schmooze with all the donors. It was only when the donors rejected him (because they could see he was only a clown) that he stumbled on the “I’m against the establishment” strategy.
Everything was there. But he was also hip and cool, and relentlessly attacked by the other tribe, and he said all the right things your primitive brain wanted to hear, so you bought his shtick entirely. The tribal social ape think is strong with this one.
Yeah, I was ready to flip out as well when I heard the news that we had sent 59 cruise missiles into an air strip in Syria.
But then more details surfaced. Sure, a lot of buildings were destroyed, some planes (6 of them) were too, but they were dime a dozen MIG-23 types. Easily replaced. But the attack was specific, they didn't damage the runways at all.
And just one airfield. They can get that back up in a day... throw up a few temp buildings, fly in some spare planes, drive some trucks in... boom. Back in business.
Not only that, but the Russians were warned in advance.
This isn't the move of someone trying to overthrow a government. This is the strategic move of a negotiator saying "Ok, let's talk."
@gerfunkable: do you know of any evidence that Assad did the gas attack? Does gassing children worse than killing them with barrel bombs? Or "precision strikes": http://www.latimes.com/world/middleeast/la-fg-iraq-mosul-casualties-20170405-story.html
@Carson: what surprises me is that he had absolutely nothing to gain from this betrayal. He dragged himself to a war that he can't possibly win.
@Anon: Trump wasn't partisan. He was anything but a dime-a-dozen republican, he went head on with the holy free trade, holy cheap labor and above all: the sacred global interventionalism. I don't question that he fooled me, but it has nothing to do with being "Republican". I'd never endorse Cruz, Rubio or McCain. He himself designed a program that resonated with the people, different from Reps and Dems, just to be another mainstream nobody after elected.
You're reading wat too much into this.
Tradition demands that a US president launch cruise missiles more or less randomly sometime early in their first term. Syria dissed him, Melina's visiting, and this was easier on his heart than Viagra.
@Smokeman: no, it's a dealbreaker. He still considers himself the President of the World, despite his whole campaign was America First. HOW he manages it is irrelevant. He is a threat to anyone, everywhere, unless (see Monday post)
@Resivan: this is the problem. He is now a traditional US president. For that role, Clinton was the better option. Now we are stuck with an incompetent, bad-tempered Clinton. Wonderful!
He did not “design” anything. Trump is not capable of “designing”, he is a total fake clown. It was the people around him (mainly Bannon) who did the designing. Well, ok Trump is good at marketing and focus testing (you know this from Scott Adams). He is good at reading what people want to hear and then feeding that to them, then switching (you should watch the StarTrek Voyager episode called “Bliss” - “I see no sign of real intelligence, it seems to be operating on highly evolved instinct”). The program that "resonated" with the people was all lies (and ISK doubling scams) and it was easy to see right through it, if one can just remember the 190th rule of acquisition.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UW-0ClktvZI
Well, Trump obamas into a War...
...an illegal War this is...
...bypassing the UN and any international Law...
...welcome back "World Police" America?
(I endorsed Trump because he might care about the big american problems, which have never been solveable by military)
Getting involved in the Syria war was pretty much inevitable, because if left unresolved the conflict will end in decades, rather than years, even if ISIS is dissolved or weakend. There were 2 options:
(a) Going into it 'opposing' Russia and allowing Turkey to become the 3rd wheel - the Hilary way
(b) Going into it in 'agreement' (of sorts) with Russia and shoving Turkey to the side
Trump chose the second path, especially considering Erdogan's current stance against the west.
And they obviously had to intervene due to the Chemical weapons being used, because (a) they are illegal and (b) allowing them would create a precedent and further escalate conflict. It's kinda why no one uses nukes anymore; when the first trigger gets pressed then you are giving carte blanche to your opponents to use their arsenal as well.
@Tithian: the conflict not ending in decades does not threaten American interests. No ISIS fighter who have been in Syria could perform attack in the US.
It's unknown who used chemical weapons (might as well be CIA).
It's not the job of any country to police genocides, it's the job of the UN Security Council. The US president has no more right to intervene in a genocide that does not threaten Americans than the president of Kongo or Chile.
Hahahaha... Really?
Trump so far has achieved nothing positive so far...
Sorry mate, we tried to warn you.
Warned about what? That he might be as bad as Hillary? It's not like I had much to lose, Hillary was already horrible, things couldn't get worse.
They didn't get any better either...
@gelven im surprised your so worked up by this. But then I thought about it more after your first answer and realized why. TD is acting like a filthy social. Social pressure about CW was the reason why he acted. Your absolutely correct in stating that if assad bombed kids with conventional weapons no would care. Its the CW which got the world social pressure to get TD to act. However you hypothesis that TD is worse than C might be a tad off.
Well, Obama was also supposed to be the candidate of "hope and change" and anti-war, look how that worked out. (Coincidentally, he too beat Hillary in an election)
> Hillary was already horrible, things couldn't get worse.
That's privilege talking. Things probably weren't going to get much worse for white heterosexual native-born citizens in the middle class. You'd be hurt by cuts in benefits programs, but your income tax rate would probably fall also; the effects might cancel out. The same logic does *not* apply to everyone.
If you immigrated to the USA from Yemen? Trump victory makes your life worse.
Transgender kid in high school? Trump victory makes your life worse.
Working poor family which depends on PPACA-expanded Medicaid for little Timmy's asthma medicine? Trump victory makes your life worse.
Terminal cancer patient who wants the option of euthanasia instead of slowly wasting away under horrific pain? Trump victory makes your death worse.
Hillary took Saudi bribes into her foundation, so at least she got paid to push horrible policy. Trump is now doing it for free which is just plain stupid.
Funfact: 59 x 650,000$ = 38,350,000$
The thing most people misunderstood about Trump is that "Make America Great Again" didn't really mean any sort of economic greatness or cultural renaissance. It meant rebuilding and reinvigorating its capacity to dictate the course of development of other countries, through military means if necessary.
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