Greedy Goblin

Monday, March 2, 2015

What highsec non-deccable corps are about?

Many "content creators" claim that everyone should "face the consequences of their actions" and shouldn't be except from "player interactions". The most surprising thing about them is that they don't rally against NPC corps and 1-man corps. Mostly because these already consequence and interaction-free corps are full of their alts who make ISK for them while they gank.

An ISK making alt has little reason to be in a group, as the main is already in a group. The player is cooperating with his main group, while the alt has no other purpose than farming and feeding the main. Those who want to be in a group while farming are highsec carebears: players whose only activity is (ineffective) ISK making and Raven leveling.

They have no effect on the EVE politics.
They have no influence.
They have no kills.
They have little ISK, since they are outcompeted by botters and multiboxers.
They are nothing! They are roleplaying a bum who sporadically do badly paying jobs.

I can't imagine why does someone pay money and spend time to roleplay an irrelevant nobody. But I've learned that social people can explain literally everything with "having fun". But it's not about them. It's about those who want to take even this nothing from the bums and force them to stay docked for a week.

This is where the ruthless capitalist and the sadistic psychopath separates: do you just ignore the unsuccessful ones and let them starve if they refuse to improve; or do you go out of your way to find them and smash their heads with a baseball bat because it's funny when they cry? The "highsec content creators" - or their fraction that survived the Erotica1 bans - clearly choose the second option, with now even targeting Ventures.

Deccing corps full of useless socials has nothing to do with competition and piracy: no one with enough brain to make serious ISK joins a "highsec industrial corp" or a "we do everything" corp. This is about pure sadism and should not be enabled. Those who want nothing but chatting with similar irrelevant losers should be left to do it. Maybe some of them realize how bad they are and start to improve if we give them some time. You can suicide gank anyone who flies bling anyway.

Before anyone would cry "space WoW", I'd repeat that these corps wouldn't be different from the NPC corps, except the chat wouldn't be spammed:
  • No POCO or POS
  • NPC corp tax collected for CONCORD
  • No tax can be collected for the corp
  • No alliance membership

PS: a cloaky Tengu works better with a ... cloak.


maxim said...

If you are a ruthless capitalist and don't care about those who cannot improve, why do you care if those who cannot improve can be ganked by gankers?

Arrendis said...

But I've learned that social people can explain literally everything with "having fun".

Pretty much anyone can explain anything with 'this triggers dopamine release in my brain and thus produces a pleasurable effect and positive reinforcement'.

Understanding why it triggers, now there's the trick.

Anonymous said...

The amount of wasted time spent worrying about what people in highsec do is amazing. Let them rot and die. Its not worth proping them up at the expense of others players by making a special corp type for them. They will either wise up or remain a faceless mass of ppl who provide content and customers for others.

Gevlon said...

@Maxim: we don't know if they can't improve. We only know they didn't. Maybe they are new or slow but can improve.

@Arrendis: no. I'm completely sure that taking drugs would trigger dopamine release and would be very much fun. I still don't take drugs. There are more important things than fun.

@Anonymous: highsec holds much more customers than nullsec. Why bother about sov or power projection or Isthars?

jstk said...

@ maxim

Because everyone is entitled to have fun in a game, despite their gameplaying being 'peasant' mode, so to speak. These changes are only enabling that while taking very little away from the game.

maxim said...

You don't improve without pressure. You only get more improvement by removing pressure if the pressure is lethal. Highsec gankers are not lethal pressure.

"everyone" includes highsec gankers.

Anonymous said...

These "social Corps" would also be a massive boon for null sec recruitment as well.

Null Sec entities that want more people would set them up and bring in noobs to evaluate them. They can advertise and recruit ALL DAY LONG without their null enemies war-deccing them into the stone ages. Sure, many would be passed up when it's obvious they're useless, but players that work out after a few months can be brought to null.

If your argument against that is "But... we, at (Enter alliance name here) won't be able to stop (Our enemy alliance) from recruiting!" then you need to step back and look at the system as a whole.

Non wardeccable Social Corps promote null alliance recruitment! Do YOUR part to support the war effort by promoting Social Corps today! Do you want to know more?

Gevlon said...

@Maxim: wardeccers don't pressurize players to play better. They pressurize them to play solo.

Anonymous said...

These people shouldn't be playing EVE at all, but the lack of any decent space game competitor combined with the anomalous and unbalanced high security area fools them into thinking they are enjoying it. When Star Citizen (finally) becomes a thing these people will likely leave and play SC instead.

Anonymous said...

I can't imagine why does someone pay money and spend time to roleplay an irrelevant nobody.
But I've learned that social people can explain literally everything with "having fun".
But it's not about them. It's about those who want to take even this nothing from the bums and force them to stay docked for a week.

People are different;)

I could ask you for example
What is so fun about trading. What is so great about buying and selling on market and make money on it?
And what does it give you to do this only to donate it away for others players.

Now for me
Im a bloody carebear;)
What makes doing mission fun for me

I can buy nice ships
I can fit them the way i want
I cant then undock them and adore them and then i can go to a mission and kill hundreds on npc with my ship.
I even get more isk for it so i can buy even more great ships which i can use to murder even more npc with

Its the small things
The graphics when the ship is in space
The sounds of your guns ripping apart the poor npc
The Explosions
The music (some of the gated missions have great music)
Killing entire fleets of npc:)

Im basicly space rich and can buy whatever ship i want

So why not go to 0.0 or lowsec and join a real corp/alliance

Well yeah that probly be great, except that it wouldnt

I would have to find a good corp/alliance
I would have to be online at certain times
I would have to follow orders!
I would have to use specific ships and guns:(
I would have to be on ventrilo mumble etc
I would have to deal with alot of people and the politics that follows
And if i were to be away from eve due to irl things or simply be away playing other games, i would probaly be kicked when i came back.

I play Eve to have fun and getting away from real life,
and the last thing i want is another job.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous at 02 March, 2015 21:48

EXACTLY! I think you're the "Everyman" of online games.

This isn't your "job", you don't think you're changing the world... so if you wanna blow up mission NPCs / mine asteroids in space, what's the big deal?

You're not out to upset the political balance of the galaxy, you're not out to fundamentally alter the balance of the economy, you're not stepping on anyone's space dick.

All you're doing is plinking along, having your own fun, doing your own thing.

If you WANTED to be an "F1 slave" participating in "the big battles", you probably could... but that starts to turn into a job. You don't want to sacrifice your independence for a "space home". You sound like you already have a home in the "real world" and only visit space.

If an online game doesn't have room for you, then it's a "specialty niche game" that doesn't have room for very many other people, either. At the same time, you shouldn't be caged or limited by your lack of wanting to join a "space gang."

"soloists" doing "Their own thing" need to ba a part of ANY coherent online game design. They are a huge part of the economy, and are quite literally, MOST of the players at any one time.

Anonymous said...

I play EVE because swg with jump to lightspeed got closed.
ED and SC are crap, although they have the 3d movement like SWG-JTL, still crap.

swtor space is a joke.

That leaves pretty much EVE and STO. If the carebeares got another goto game they would go.

Unknown said...

Well, apart from wardecs, one main displeasure of player corps is the shitty role management, It is undocumented, un-intuitive, it gets a chore for CEOs and directors.
acces permissions cannot be limited in a functional way to prevent corp theft.
Corp thefts have absolutely no consequences since any ISK or asset stolen can easily be transferred to a convenient alt and the thief can then get biomassed or better, sold on the basar...
In this way, EVE/CCP punish peaceful cooperation.
On the other hand, in order to have a shiny killboard and have fun blowing other pilots up, just join BB or Spectrefleet or redemption road.... No need to join a corp or "find friends"...

On the other hand, "academy corps" can be a nice thing for player retention, CODE. is certainly not...

The reason why so much more players farm in highsec? Read the above posts.
It is independance, playing casually, doing missions anytime, joining NPSI fleets anytime...
Not having to deal with idiots...

On a totally different topic.

Someone who logs into EVE to update his market orders for a few hours a day and then spending the billions of profit as a welfare program for pvp pilots who are not able to either properly loot their ennemies wrecks or to simply farm enough for their losses (inefficient playstyle) or who farms mining missions afk in Hodrold is not really in a proper position to judge whether mission runners in highsec a m&s.

Making money to give it away? And even with confirmed statistic data that his efforts, which are still remarkable, have nor serious effect on goons as an entity.

I do totally accept GG's playstyle though I do not think that his playstyle is the most efficient or favorable.
EVE has so many aspects that literally any playstyle that keeps a player logging in and subbed must be called successful.

It is like MoA, they are totally irrelevant in regard of sov warfare, although they provide hilarious goon ALODs to please us all, but are they winning EVE?

In a sandbox game, where every player needs to define his own "win condition" there cannot be one single "right" playstyle...

If all those "idiot m&s" raven levellers weren'T logging in and fulfilling GG's market orders even he would have to do more security missions or incursions to get ISK...

this is what makes EVE so unique.
there is no heroic dragon lychlord or whatever to kill every 6 weeks in order to prove to be the biggest hero in New Eden, anything goes, be it ganking miners, be it mining or doing missions, be it exploring, running 0.0 anoms or pushing f1 with dabigredboat or any other FC...

If all the allegiations/accusations of RMT were true (which I have absolutely no clue about)then only the big alliance leaders play the "right" way and everybody else who can't finance his villa with EVE is just a M&S... (capitalist view)

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said:
"In a sandbox game, where every player needs to define his own "win condition" there cannot be one single "right" playstyle..."

I apologize for taking this out of the context you intended, but it serves as a good lead to a different point:

There CAN be "One right way to play" in a sandbox. It's the way that produces the greatest net gain for itself at the greatest cost for the other play styles. But it's not the "right" way, it's the most cost effective way.

In Eve, trading and asymmetric combat (blobbing) are those playstyles.

billybob said...

Could you break this down to condi member corps so we can shame people on the forums please?