Greedy Goblin

Wednesday, May 31, 2017

Multiculturalism is impossible because of morons and slackers

We grow up with a picture of morons and slackers. We know where they are frequent, we know how they behave and above all, we know how to avoid trouble with them. But our experiences are culture-bound. Successful, (somewhat) rational people are similar from all around the World: I worked with Americans, Egyptians, Japanese and all kinds of Europeans in my professional life without once considering them dissimilar from me. Sure, they all had folklore elements, different stories and preferences in entertainment, but they we left these at the door when we entered the lab, the plant or the conference room.

Morons and slackers on the other hand are very different by culture and their characteristics are not at all superficial. It's not a background, something they carry and capable to manage, this is source of pride for them - well, they can't be proud of their performance after all! Only when reading about unrests and criminal endemics of different cultures I realized that. To illustrate this, let me introduce the Hungarian M&S. You can spot them with your eyes closed, from the smell of pálinka. The ability to make moonshine for a Hungarian is like the ability to bear arms for a Southern state American. When the current government got office, one of their earliest laws were liberating home distilleries. Never that party got below 80% vote in rural counties ever since. About 10% of the country is massive alcoholist. Aggressively offering drinks in social events is common. At Easter - holiday for visiting relatives - all policemen are on duty to catch drunken drivers and never they fail to do so in hundreds. Binge drinking for youth is "normal". But nothing compares to New Year's Eve. This time of year the M&S of Hungary goes to war against everyone with grenades and missile launchers they euphemistically call "fireworks". The government - even the communist dictatorship back then - is powerless to stop this custom. Every year thousands of terrified pets run off, hundreds of people get burn or lose fingers by mishandling their tools of retarded celebration, dozens of homes burn down and - if the night is cold - dozens freeze to death when they lay down for a little alcohol induced nap on the streets.

Intelligent people learned to live with this madness. Couples go with two cars to social events so both of them can reject drinks on the excuse of driving (only works for somewhat civilized parties, M&S has an often repeated and bumper-sticker announced saying "cars need gas, not licence"). Pets are locked in homes for the day of war on common sense or the whole family runs to rural relatives (less people, less shooting). Notorious soccer clubs are avoided in time of games because meeting with intoxicated "fans" can turn into one sided street brawls.

Average Hungarians can avoid trouble because we know how the M&S behave and can plan around it. But imagine a town where half of the M&S is Hungarian, insisting on banging on doors, throwing fireworks at homes and demanding everyone they meet to drink their moonshine; while the other half is gun-loving American rednecks, ready to shoot anyone and everyone stepping on their lawn. New Years Eve would be quite "interesting", don't you think?!

Countries must be mono-cultural, because only one kind of M&S can be managed at once. As long as all M&S are the same, intelligent people can de-escalate the situation. If there are two kinds, you can't know which kind will show up next corner. And if two different M&S meet, trouble is guaranteed.

It's not like Muslims are worse than us or have more morons. It's just that their morons are very different from ours, therefore it's impossible to have them at the same place without bodies on the street. Burka - contrary to common belief - isn't religious clothing. It's a common sense defense of women against the entitled young Muslim morons forming street gangs and grabbing every woman who they can see. While they are probably capable of realizing that there is a woman below the burka, since they don't see them, they aren't triggered. Is it pathetic? Yes. Is it disgusting that woman must wear that to be safe? Yes. But objectively it's not more disgusting than Hungarians having to entrench themselves at their home every year because of those idiots. We just got used to it, so we don't complain anymore. Same for Muslim country women. But Western women are not used to this practice and become victims of these gangs. Even worse, they can't even pick up this practice to defend themselves, because a local moron will attack them and kill those who intervene. You can't wear burka against Muslim morons and cowgirl costume against rednecks at the same time!

Every country must have one and only one culture and every different cultures must be suppressed to avoid war on the streets. The liberal "can't we all live together in peace" is impossible because every group have large amount of morons looking for trouble. Since being moron is in their core, they can't be forced to stop. You can only kill them as secular dictatorships do to upkeep a pretense of change. Educated people, who live in elite bubbles, isolated from the M&S of their own culture don't see this and end up surprised when either the M&S of their culture attack the aliens or their bubble - designed against local M&S - is penetrated by the alien M&S.

I realize that it's unfair. Eating pork is not more "right" than not eating. Western clothing isn't "better" than eastern. But one set of behavior must be allowed and all else banned. This only allows minorities to exist in the closet. I do call for the deportation of those who violate the local cultural bans, despite I do find the bans stupid. But anyone who is not capable to at least publicly fake the dominant culture is not rational enough to live with different people without deadly problems. Every country must become a cultural monolith and migrants can only be accepted after their assimilation capacity is verified. Else, fireworks will be our smallest of problems.

The in-game parallel of this is the all-male guilds. The leaders flat out say that the problem isn't with women, but with the man-children who can't focus in the presence of women and try to court her instead of focusing on the job at hand. Since there are more man-children than women in the gaming scene, he is better off unfairly rejecting the women than trying to make the man-children grow up. While I was never shy kicking the sexist man-children, I do accept that both guilds have right to exist and must only be judged by their merit measured in raiding success. But there indeed cannot be a guild that has both women and sexist man-children. That guild just can't function.

18 comments:

Anonymous said...

Self-Defense?
Such a thing should not be required for Women to feel safe. The assholes that form such gangs should be punished accordingly, whether that is prison or the death sentence.

Now as to your other post....you still need to learn more about Americans and the US.
If you have not already you should try and come visit us for awhile.
I personally am not an "Alpha Male toting a gun."
I am a United States Veteran with Honorable Discharge, I have taken an Oath to my Constitution and my Country. And I firmly believe if it ever came down to it to defend the Constitution and the Bill of Rights in such a manner, that yes I would happily take up arms, against Muslims, Christians, Pagans, Foreign Invaders, even my own family if such were to endanger that document or the Freedoms it provides.

I truly feel for you or anyone that is fearful of Jail time or such for speaking plainly. And it is sad that in the US such a conflict may be looming over the horizon.
For now, we can say what ever we wish within reason(ie, not making a deadly threat), but I am sure me and others like me would be damned if a Law was placed saying you could be jailed for example speaking badly of Islam without taking up arms and saying FUCK YOU to the Government and anybody else that tries to force that shit down the throat of United States Citizens.
I have the inalienable (God given if your religious) right to say what i wish within reason, and to defend myself, family and property from irrevocable harm and secured in Law by the 1st Amendment Right to Free Speech, and the 2nd Amendment Right to Bear Arms.
I have the Right to demand a Legal Writ be Issued by Judge and presented to me or be able to refuse search and seizure of my person and belongings.
I have the Right to not speak to the Law
I have the Right to be provided a proper Advocate of the Law
I have the Right to not languish rotting in a Jail cell without trial for months,or years on end (speedy trial)
I have the Right to question my accusers
I have the Right to not have my private property used by the Government without just compensation.
I have the Rights and Powers not secured to the Federal or State Government to ensure I can Feed, Clothe, and House myself in any Legal (not harming anyone)manner that I see fit.

I have the Right to Defend others if possible, no, I have the Duty to Defend others if possible which include all manner of Religion, Gender, and Race...
So nope I am not a gun toting Alpha Male, I am a Soldier, retired or not currently, I am a Soldier and it is my Right and my Duty to defend these rights against anyone or thing that would infringe upon them as a Citizen of the United States.

That is the difference between the US and many others, I do not have to like what you say, or how you live(peacefully), but I will defend your Rights to do so till Death.
I Do not want to die for you, but if Dying is what I Have to do, then I shall secure your Freedom with my Dying breath.

Anonymous said...

And yet nations have existed with multiple cultures within them for centuries.

Gevlon said...

@Anon: indeed, it SHOULD not be required for anyone for feeling safe. But criminal justice system can only deal with small groups. The USA already has higher prison population than any other country, yet gangs like Latin Knights and MS-13 are openly operating on the streets.

For a Muslim country, such approach is impossible. To lock up everyone who harasses women would mean locking up 20-30% of their population. That's impossible.

While indeed no one is jailed for political opinion in the US, lots of people lost their jobs for speaking up against liberalism or safe spaces or BLM or whatnot.

Finally and most importantly: you don't HAVE the right, these rights were FORCIBLY GAINED in the war of independence (good luck with your rights had the redcoats won) and these rights are FORCIBLY UPHELD by those who fought for it (good luck with your rights if Hitler had won).

Other cultures (most recently: Muslim) does not recognize these rights. They say that you can't speak against their holy book or religious figures. Hell, you can't even paint them. They say women are mere property of their father or husband. I doubt if peaceful coexistence in one country is more possible than with King George or Hitler.

@Last anon: care to name one?

Anonymous said...

>care to name one?

Belgium has existed in its current form for almost two centuries. It includes Flemish, Walloon, and German communities with very different languages, customs, and levels of prosperity. There are separatist political parties, and some of the citizens cannot speak their neighbor's language (because they refuse to learn, due to laziness or bigotry). Yet they aren't stabbing each other in the streets or suicide-bombing each others' capital cities.

Spain has included Basque territories for hundreds of years. They're not fully integrated into the national culture and they retain their own weird language. There have been a few periods of terrorism and violent repression, but things are reasonably peaceful at the moment.

The Ottoman empire was cosmopolitan as heck, but it was arguably an assemblage of monocultural nations rather than a cohesive and diverse nation.

Palestine has historically been a mixing ground for various peoples and cultures. It was frequently conquered, but total ethnic cleansing didn't occur especially often (and there were usually a few semi-nomadic groups such as Bedouin hanging around, in case things weren't complicated enough). The conquerors usually just setup a new government and then told everybody to pay their taxes. The Jews (and later, the early Christians) were notably persecuted by the Romans because they resisted taxation and state religion.

The Ainu people of Hokkaido have lived under the Japanese aegis since the Edo period. The Meiji government absorbed them formally into the nation ... but also sought to dilute their culture and assimilate them fully. Some traditions remain, but it's debatable whether an Ainu culture still exists within modern Japan. They're a bit more culturally distinct within Russia, but their numbers are so small that they're almost totally irrelevant to national affairs.

Gevlon said...

@Anon: all your examples are about successful assimilation or only formal coexistence (the parts of Belgium are independent and locally pure (Vallons live with Vallons). Basques aren't happy with being oppressed, they blew bombs. I guess they'll finally be assimilated and the problem goes away. Citing Palestine as all places for successful multiculturalism is 10/10. Even you accept that Ainu culture disappeared.

So no, your examples aren't working.

Shalcker said...

I would say that "multicultural" countries like Russia do that through geographic segregation.

There is "common" culture you get through common media channels (books, TV, internet, songs and so on in dominant language) that allows mobility within country and there is "local" culture that can be as different from others as it wants, including retaining their own language.

When people move outside of their culture they either self-segregate and mostly stick with their own (common for largely tribal cultures like Chechens) or they accept trappings of local culture and leave their own traditions to their family gatherings.

Anonymous said...

It's a common sense defense of women against the entitled young Muslim morons forming street gangs and grabbing every woman who they can see.
you mean like sweedish girls veil themselves in hope to not get taharrushed?


the difference of Hungarian M&S that correlates with low IQ and social status and muslims that have every class and range of IQ. Because there is a doctrine behind muslims not behind M&S. you have Doctors and master degree muslims that regurgitate islamic ideology. in contrast; the upper-class Hungarian isn't drenched in vodka and shoots pyro stuff out of his ass.

also Hungarian M&S is unequal as a Dutch M&S. there are some similarities but no shared agenda or doctrine. It isn't the same for muslims with different ethnicity, maybe there is a difference in ignorance for sure. But the quran lays it out and the hadith and sunna guide them in detail. in the end islam follows an agenda. And how this works out in reality is for everyone to see and I leave it at that.


But Western women are not used to this practice and become victims of these gangs.
Western police can't handle taharrush. This level of savagery and brutality is too much to handle, especially if on every action some feminist/SJW idiots brush the police as racists etc.. Also courts handle it in the worst way, the taharrush performing people got very lenient sentences, there are only a handful somewhatgood sentences. Still it is the wrong signal to send to those people.


one culture
We have one constitution and only one law. In theory this is the anchor that should dictate everything else in a society. if you are a law abiding citizen I don't care what you believe, do, eat, fuck, cultural appropriate, trigger or shitpost and so vice versa. Sure every western constitution is bombarded on all fronts from various lobbies, SJW and feminists and more.
Still, as corrupt and suboptimal as it is, it is still the best thing we have.
And there is the problem they want to have "their religious law" over "our law" .. so no wonder there is clash.

Gevlon said...

@Anon: you have no idea what an educated Muslim look like, because those live in Muslim countries where you are not seeing them, or arrive only for business and behave professionally so make no waves. So you (mis)judge a whole culture based on what poured to your country. Also, obnoxious things are more visible, if you'd be in Hungary, you wouldn't notice the hundreds of ordinary citizens minding their business, but you sure as hell would notice the "football fan" who shouts slogans into your face with enough alcohol in his breath to knock out a whale.

Law doesn't help against culture. People just don't keep it and no one cares. Remember that when Jim Crow laws were cancelled, nothing changed until the National Guard moved in to enforce the new laws. Trump has lots of trouble catching illegals as whole cities decide that they don't keep the laws. Sure, he could send in the NG, and May can send the Army to the streets of Manchester, but how long can countries operate on de facto state of emergency?! The problem is that criminals know that they are criminals and try to avoid detection. These people see no problem in what they are doing, they consider the authorities evil oppressors and everyone around them agree with them, or at least consider them "boys will be boys"

Anonymous said...

On one hand, multiculturalism is a wonderful and laudable policy that has no downsides whatsoever.

On the other hand, the imperial powers were evil for creating Sykes-Picot borders and African borders that ignored regional cultural and ethnic differences, and therefore are to blame for many modern conflicts.

Sorry liberal friends, but you can't have it both ways !

Phelps said...

Rednecks love moonshine and fireworks -- they are just illegal, so it's all "discreetly" out of the way.

Some redneck fun when you have time to spend on a documentary:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=glQjCKAI4gA

Gevlon said...

@Phelbs: of course they do. Guess what, "muslim" terrorists are often drunkards too. But there is a difference between idiots doing "hold my beer" nonsense and a peaceful country turning into Falujjah overnight.

Anonymous said...

you have no idea what an educated Muslim look like, because those live in Muslim countries where you are not seeing them, or arrive only for business and behave professionally so make no waves.
calling an Anon out. good.
I work with 3 muslims on my team daily. 2 are blissful ignorant sunflower muslims just like ignorant westerners. the other is practising taqiyya. all three are highly skilled and educated, otherwise they wouldn't be there. I live at the edge of a very muslim populated area in Germany. Anyway our Anecdotal stories don't count. But as I said as long as they are law abiding and keep to them selves like we do, I don't care.

if you screeech patriarchy about all research and polls, ok. just follow sharia resident educated muslims on facebook or twitter and watch what happens if some islamic martyr explodes in the west killing kufr or in shia countries killing hypocrites. I try to read all the official "human rights" people in sharia countries and of course arabic twitter / facebook horrorfest. you need arabic reading friends or use google translate (google sucks, but is better than nothing). if you don't want to look there, watch at MEMRI some translated videos, they have the most progressive bits of arabic sharia ruled tv airings (usually very late night on low rating channels, BUT it was aired there). it can't get more progressive than that under sharia rule. and god speed for the brave people trying to critique islam and survive the consequences over there.
But all this will do nothing if you don't know what islam is. don't trust me, read their popular sources in 4-6 different translations. and follow ex-muslims, they usually have all the right pointers of the top of their head if you want a shortcut.

Nearly all terrorist top dogs are educated and devout muslims. there is nothing comparable under any M&S because they would transcend from M&S wouldn't they.


In theory law and secular concept should suffice. that it isn't I don't argue. but it is the best we have and worth defending. I don't think that a counter culture will help at all. Its to late, the values will be too triggering for todays western society. maybe if more women get raped and more people die, maybe then. but until then it is best to shut up and don't list the facts, because one will get witch hunted as an alt-right or what ever nazi.
In practice. all the things you list and more happen. like your counter culture will also fail because of it. Russia does it under a heavy hand rule, somehow the narrative seems to take a hold and patriotism, family and being a upright citizen seems popular enough.


Sure, he could send in the NG, and May can send the Army to the streets of Manchester, but how long can countries operate on de facto state of emergency?
wilfully ignoring the motive? please elaborate?
Why do so many "individual bad apples" and "unrelated incidents" all look the same? AS if they where commanded somehow.

they consider the authorities evil oppressors
remember hudaybiyyah. and all ignorant people clap and think they have a good deal, and those who know, most of iran at that time, laugh and stop protesting the treaty.

And it seems you talk about a larger group here. And majority pools brush a very disheartening picture.

And again. I have no quarrel with secular law abiding citizens. I would like some more decency, but hey modern edgy time.

Anonymous said...

>all your examples are about successful assimilation or only formal coexistence ... so no, your examples aren't working.

You're shifting the goalposts. You asked for examples of nations with multiple cultures. Now you're rejecting them all via no-true-scotsman.

If I say that New York City has a well-established Chinatown then you'll dismiss it as a regional enclave which is separate from the dominant American culture (not true multiculturalism!). If I say that Vancouver has European and Asian customs and genetics coexisting side-by-side, then you'll just argue that those separate culture have been assimilated into a new homogenous "Vancouver" culture (not true multiculturalism!). Could you please give a rough hypothetical example of something that *would* satisfy your arguments, so that we know what to look for?

In Isreal, Bedouin slackers refuse to deal with modernity or ID documents or census-takers; they just want to herd livestock. Hasidim slackers refuse to serve in the military or get regular jobs; they live on the dole and raise huge families and complain about how sinful everyone else is. Urban slackers in Tel Aviv do hippie bullshit and protest against government policies. By your reasoning, Israel should be falling apart because nobody would be able to deal with multiple types of slackers.

For an outsider (such as a tourist), this stuff probably *would* be chaotic and confusing. But someone who grows up in Israel (and who *isn't* isolated into a single kibbutz for their whole life) can usually get used to it.

It's going to take a bit more work to convince me that multiculturalism is mathematically impossible.

Gevlon said...

@Anon: no, Chinatowns work not just because they are enclaves (so is Mollenbeek), but because Chinese culture is non-violent and non-expansive. Hell, the real big China tolerates capitalist Hong Kong as semi-independent. Chinese are a rare exception. Now, I doubt if THEY agree with US being non-violent and non-expansive. I'm sure they could list lots of racism going their way from white morons.

Vancouver I can't talk about, because I'm uninformed.

Israel exists for one reason: external aid (same for Palestine from Muslim countries). If the rest of the World would cut the aid (no embargo, just normal trade), both Israel and Palestine would become Third World hellholes exactly for the reasons you listed. Also, even WITH aid, ever second year there is a mini-war with a couple thousand dead, mostly children.

bg. said...

There may be a reason the Bible has a story about the Babel Tower... For those into it, if there is an obvious religious argument against multi-culturalism, this is it...

Anonymous said...

I do think "country" is a bit inaccurate. A GDC talk by Raph Koster (UO and SWG and SOE designer) on making good forums talking about keeping forums small and moncultural - e.g. don't have one WoW forum but have WoW crafting, WoW PvP, ... He used the example of Switzerland, famous for multiple cultures but saying they work due to several essentially monoculture regions/cantons.

David Boshko said...

Or go to the other extreme and get so many cultures that any one brand of idiot is insignificant. New York seems to work fine. Having mostly two cultures in an area, on the other hand, tends not to work very well.

Anonymous said...

Blogger Gevlon said...

@Anon: indeed, it SHOULD not be required for anyone for feeling safe. But criminal justice system can only deal with small groups. The USA already has higher prison population than any other country, yet gangs like Latin Knights and MS-13 are openly operating on the streets.

For a Muslim country, such approach is impossible. To lock up everyone who harasses women would mean locking up 20-30% of their population. That's impossible.

While indeed no one is jailed for political opinion in the US, lots of people lost their jobs for speaking up against liberalism or safe spaces or BLM or whatnot.

Finally and most importantly: you don't HAVE the right, these rights were FORCIBLY GAINED in the war of independence (good luck with your rights had the redcoats won) and these rights are FORCIBLY UPHELD by those who fought for it (good luck with your rights if Hitler had won).
What you are not understanding, is this.....

@Gevlon: Those Rights i speak of, are my Rights despite any positive or negative consequences.It is my Right to defend myself by any means necessary dependent only upon the type of circumstances involved, it is my Right to deny you or anybody else going through my belongings or tresspassing onto my property, and if that means i have to kill an officer of the "law" that was not granted something to give me reason to appear before the law, than I am sorry, if it came to that for me to feel that action was/is necessary than that is what i would do.

These Rights I basically spoke of are actual Rights that no actual Government or group can give or take away. Only the individual can decide whether or not and when to exercise those rights.
However in America(US), we also because of the Brits and King George made sure to include these Rights into the Highest Law of our Land.
And yes we Americans are a really fucked up people, but history has shown on many occasions that we can/will/and do band together decisively when it is required.
I honestly believe that someone or a bunch of someones could attempt to invade and destroy the US, but it would take years maybe decades and millions upon Millions of casualties to do so.....it would not be worth the effort.
Because if there is one thing I have heard said about us while going abroad, Americans are crazy and assholes...it is very much true unfortunately, but we have good reason to be that way.