Greedy Goblin

Thursday, March 17, 2016

Goons getting 20T/month is so broken like ... oh wait!

At the end of January, my total wealth passed 400B. Downwards, as I was donating 14B/week to MoA and OOS and I had to cut back on mining missions because of real life and I couldn't make more than 40B/month with implant trading. I had to downsize a bit and hope that I will have more time before I can't support 14B/week and have to admit this.

Fast forward 6 weeks and I'm closing to 1T total assets without the SP farming characters. I play less than I used to and if I make less than 3B a day, that's a bad day. If they increase broker fees, I'll probably make 150-200B a month, 100B more than I used to with more grinding than I preferred. What happened? Skill injectors and extractors. First, being a multi-account, relatively old player, I had a bunch of high SP pilots to strip. Then I hauled the implants in my "usual" Tengus. Bought plex by dozens, converted to AUR, bought extractors and sold them. Do you have "usual" hauling Tengus, trader pilots and capital to buy 2-300 injectors a day and ship them? No, then you are out of luck, just like everyone without 5-6 full fleets of F1 pushers will be out of luck when Citadels come online.

I'm one player. Imperium + Panfam + NC. [+ Russian alliance] is at least 40K. If they get the 25T/month, absolutely game-breaking ISK, they'll get 625M/month/player. I got at least 100000M/month/player from skill trading. How is it not totally broken? A "oh my god so op" incursion runner with 200M/hour could not make this money if he'd play 24 hours a day, 30 days a month and I barely play 90 minutes. A PLEX in 20 minutes, how is it not broken?! I must have bought awful lot of beers to CCP devs to make these loopholes for me.

Maybe the devs aren't more Goonlovers to give them new Jita than me-lovers for letting me make this stupid amount of money. Maybe they just don't give enough attention to the economy of EVE and don't even think they should. I'd bet in large sums that there are more CCP devs who can tell the bonuses of the Merlin without looking up than those who could tell the magnitude (10B? 100B? 1T? 10T?) of the ISK the Imperium corps make from ratting taxes. Which one shapes EVE more, Merlins or SRP? Is SMA failcascading because of bad frig piloting or because a few rich guys got mad at them?

I'm prone to forget Hanlon's razor. When I see patchnotes that will lead to a game-breaking income to a coalition, I assume that everyone sees the same, while likely only Goon economists seen it besides me. CCP needs an economy focus group and a dev team assigned to the economy. It's much more important than module tiericide or balancing Jackdaw against Svipul as it moves the politics. If I'm on that focus group, I gladly share how could my absolutely broken income decreased (one free advice: decrease broker fee). There is awful lot of player knowledge available and experts gladly share it and we aren't even manipulative liar politicians like most CSM. We like EVE and don't want to see it break. Please don't break it with GoonPL making 20T a month or me making 0.2T alone.

18 comments:

Anonymous said...

Goons will have their economy expert on the CSM. Maybe you should have presented yourse- ohh, wait.

Borat Guereen said...

If I am elected to CSM XI, you are one of the few that I will immediately contact to be on my advisory team, regardless of your position on the CSM. This is not a call for you to change your stance at that stage, just a public statement.

I may find your opinions too abrupt from time to time, but I always pay attention to them. It is rare to see players that are willing to challenge the game on things they do benefit from, and I like to believe we have this in common, even if my main area of expertise is far removed from yours.

Anonymous said...

Fun fact: the same Dev who "improved" faction warfare by making completely economically broken and mass exploited by goons, is the same dev now working on the citadel.

Gevlon said...

@Anon: The CSM is a Goon tool. It doesn't matter what I would say there, it wouldn't even be listened. Or do you think any employees would dare to directly confront Falcon by even talking to me? The only way to get a message is loudly trough reddit.

@Borat: you are a useful idiot to Goons. Shame on you!

@Anonymous: Jesus, the FW guy wasn't fired for incompetence?!

Anonymous said...

Why is Borat a useful idiot to Goons, he is a small gang player who stood on that platform for the previous CSM, he had some pretty good ideas.

One important thing I suggested on the Eve forums on Citadels was that they allowed the Citadel owner to allow or disallow trading on their blue list, this was a key requirement.

Now I just noticed that a market hub can not be created in a Medium Citadel as the service module cannot fit, WTF that is crazy, then no hisec group will have a market Hub. Damn the stupidity of CCP again. Face palm...

Dracvlad

Gevlon said...

He is running for CSM. Win or lose, his only effect will be giving legitimacy to that Goon tool.

Anonymous said...

@Anon
"WTF that is crazy, then no hisec group will have a market Hub"
No highsec group will be able to put up a large citadel? That's news to me.

Anonymous said...

@Gevlon
If you won't be listened by being in the CSM, why would a focus group be any different? You will be ignored all the same!

Gevlon said...

Public eye. The focus group isn't running behind closed doors. Also, even if the devs literally block my posts to avoid Falcon's wrath, the other participant players listen to good arguments and implement them into their posts. Other CSMs wouldn't listen to 1+1=2 if their group interest is 1+1=3. Sure, there will be Goon minions in focus groups, but as their posts are public, they become Reddit hilarity for obvious lies.

Zax said...

" What happened? Skill injectors and extractors. First, being a multi-account, relatively old player, I had a bunch of high SP pilots to strip. Then I hauled the implants in my "usual" Tengus. Bought plex by dozens, converted to AUR, bought extractors and sold them. Do you have "usual" hauling Tengus, trader pilots and capital to buy 2-300 injectors a day and ship them? "

Is this sustainable indefinitely for your new business model?
It seems to be the new business model for many players.

If it is sustainable indefinitely, then it will lead to many players getting very rich permanently, if not, then income will drop back to what it was before.

Gevlon said...

@Zax: my 40B/month implant business was profitable for 3 years and I guess still is, I just have no time for both. The Thukker LP is still 2x more valuable than Empire LP despite being just as easy to get. People are dumb.

Anonymous said...

Nope, here he is in 2012 giving his famous "/10000" formula.

https://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/fw-dev-blog-1-1-1/

Foo said...

Gevlon wants to ensure that the CSM won't listen to him. He is doing what he can to discourage candidates that would be sympathetic to his views.

On Today's CSM: Sugar, Mike, and Steve are all approachable and otherwise sympathetic to the concerns raised.

I see some of the data that Gevlon sees, and sometimes come to different conclusions. One of which is that giving a player group a different name will cause a magically different outcome. (I do not).

Players have a choice. We can choose those that represent us to talk a little louder in the ear of CCP, or we can allow others to have that voice.

For me that choice is easy, I am participating in CSM elections.




Cathfaern said...

@Foo: "Players have a choice. We can choose those that represent us to talk a little louder in the ear of CCP, or we can allow others to have that voice."
Gavlon says that doesn't matter what others says in the CSM because the imperium minions will have majority. It's a nice idea that you can outloud them, but not true. If they have majority (and they will) then their voice is overrepresented. And Gevlon says that the only solution to cease (or ridicule) the CSM so CCP won't listen to them. And one of the best method to achive this to make voters to stay away from CSM. Because if the participation is really low then maybe CCP devs would still listen to the CSM members but the CCP leaders will stop the influence. Well at least according to Gevlon, because who knows how racional the CCP lead is.

Anonymous said...

I'm a bit surprised skill injectors stay stable while at the same time PLEX and extractor prices are in decline. This makes SP farming more profitable every day...

Provi Miner said...

I was struck a simple plan to derail the supposed SRP you imagine.

What is the one thing even the goons won't do? Who is the one entity left who all of eve respects and to degree trust?

have him set up Citadels in rens, hek, amarr, and jita. First not even the goons are dumb enough to attack the one person every can accept, the one person who can work a deal between two people who hate, despise and don't trust each other. Have him set a minimum tax (enough to cover costs) and bam your fears are over.

Gevlon said...

@Provi Miner: nice naivity. https://zkillboard.com/kill/48421665/

Provi Miner said...

So its code them cats got crossed wires not even goons really like them lol