Rixx Javix of Evoganda wrote that he is receiving supportive letters and convos from readers. Every blogger have these and all of us are grateful for them. Nothing is more rewarding for blogging than "hi, your blog helped me a lot with [insert real life issue]". My dearest letter came from a guy who did a lowly paying job to be able to support his alcohol-afflicted parents and brother, but later he left them and moved to another city where he is still doing lowly paying job, but now to support himself doing college. He wrote that previously the feeling of guilt and obligation to them stopped him, but after reading my blogs about M&S he realized that he isn't responsible for other adults, they are responsible for themselves.
But this post isn't about "who has the warmest story". It's about the opposite. The haters. Those who cause us to censor comments with their death threats and casual "you are worse than Hitler, kill yourself" comments. They are primitives who hate ideas because they don't have any. They should not stop any blogger from blogging (like they did with Ripard).
But it's one thing to deleting them from your blog and telling them that if they are unable to form a coherent counter-argument, then they are irrelevant. It's another to go to place where they can physically attack you. Rixx, listen to your wife, going to Fanfest is a bad idea! It doesn't matter if 90% of your readers like or at least appreciate the content you provide. It doesn't matter if 99.99% of the people out there would never commit a violent crime. You need just one mentally unstable person to grab a knife from a table or a stone from the road to end your life.
While they could be anywhere and one can rightfully say that the possibility of a madman attack shouldn't stop us from speaking up, Fanfest is extra-dangerous for three reasons:
PS: How to hide a link Tengu? Best idea is blooming its signature by an MWD! If you have 1B cargo, maybe you shouldn't use a T1 industrial in nullsec. What happens if Goon minions meet equal number of pirates?
But this post isn't about "who has the warmest story". It's about the opposite. The haters. Those who cause us to censor comments with their death threats and casual "you are worse than Hitler, kill yourself" comments. They are primitives who hate ideas because they don't have any. They should not stop any blogger from blogging (like they did with Ripard).
But it's one thing to deleting them from your blog and telling them that if they are unable to form a coherent counter-argument, then they are irrelevant. It's another to go to place where they can physically attack you. Rixx, listen to your wife, going to Fanfest is a bad idea! It doesn't matter if 90% of your readers like or at least appreciate the content you provide. It doesn't matter if 99.99% of the people out there would never commit a violent crime. You need just one mentally unstable person to grab a knife from a table or a stone from the road to end your life.
While they could be anywhere and one can rightfully say that the possibility of a madman attack shouldn't stop us from speaking up, Fanfest is extra-dangerous for three reasons:
- Unlike political speakers, we are present in the cyberspace as avatars. People simply don't know who we are in real life and even if they knew, they'd have to travel far to find us. Most lunatics who decide to kill us would cool down and change his mind before he'd pack his luggage. In Fanfest you'll be literally at arm's length to them.
- In Fanfest, there will be alcohol. Most idiots who would attack while sober are already locked up in an institution. But some alcohol can make them brave enough to act. Almost half of the violent crimes are committed by ones under the influence of alcohol.
- In Fanfest, there will be a supportive micro-audience. Not just one guy hates you. Several do. Most of them - even when drunk - are just talking. When they say "there goes that faggot Rixx, someone should bash his head" they are just being loud drunks. But the mentally unstable guy takes it as support of "the people". He can believe that he'll be a hero if he does what "everyone" wants. Of course they will tell the police that they were just fooling around and they had no idea that anyone would actually perform an attack. They probably feel bad about their words and be genuinely sorry, but that won't help you.
PS: How to hide a link Tengu? Best idea is blooming its signature by an MWD! If you have 1B cargo, maybe you shouldn't use a T1 industrial in nullsec. What happens if Goon minions meet equal number of pirates?
43 comments:
I think that's a bit to extreme, there will be security and police on the fanfest.
And I cannot believe someone would really stab someone because of a game.
And I think CCP will probably track the threat-er real identity and keep some eyes on him if he appears on the Fanfest.
Actually, the opposite is more likely to happen: RJ-haters might meet him in person, and realize that in person, they can at least respect each other.
Yes, sometimes people go overboard, but not to the extreme you are describing. In fact, going to FF might be the safest place on earth, because it takes :money: and :effort: to get there - you are more likely to get run over by a car just going shopping.
In essence, Gevlon, you are talking out of your ass. And I say that because I have been to Fanfest and its drunken shenanigans, and /you haven't/.
"how not to fit a carrier" goes on
https://zkillboard.com/kill/45160102/
https://zkillboard.com/kill/45162717/
charon's travelling mode - https://zkillboard.com/kill/45158978/
@ Alessandro - like the saying goes: one man's junk is another man's treasure. Only in this case: One mans reasonable expectations for civility is another mans straight jacket.
@ GG - when I first saw the title of the post I was wondering if Rixx ruffled your feathers. ;)
@Druur: last year, 4 people who made money and effort to go there vandalized the monument. That's a crime you know.
I think it's sad you think so low of your fellow EVE Players. I have been to quite a few meets and have never once felt insecure or afraid infact it was quite the opposite, the EVE players made me feel welcome and did their best to bring me into the conversation.
Your assertion that someone will shank someone else at Fanfest is tinfoil worthy, you should spend some time getting to know people in EVE instead of insulting them.
EVE players are people. In the USA for 100K citizens in 2013 there are:
Homicide: 4.7
Forcible rape: 26.9
Robbery: 112.9
Aggravated assault: 242.3
If we assume there will be 5K people in Fanfest, you'll meet 0.23 murderer, 1.35 rapist, 5.65 robber and 12.11 brawler.
I don't know how you feel, but 23% chance to meet a murderer isn't comforting.
@Anon 08.05 'I think it's sad you think so low of your fellow EVE Players.'
From Rixx's blog
'You may be ready to dismiss this, but that is because you are not aware of my "stalker", or the threats, or the supposed "parody" accounts, or the apparently jealous blogger, or any of the other things I have to deal with.'
Nobody is going to get beaten up or stabbed at fanfest, and to suggest they are is ridiculous. Even you would be safe if you went there, because most people don't give enough of a crap about what people do online, and the few that do are more likely to show up at your house than a public event.
The truth is, he's more likely to meet people who even if they don't like his online persona will sit down for a beer and a burger and get to know him.
As for yourself, honestly, if you went to fanfest I'd be more worried about what you would do to other people than what others would do to you.
Oh and do stop using the monument as an example. A couple of people acting like children and scratching a name off of a monument is a far cry from assaulting someone. Of all the times I've been to fanfest I've not seen anyone beaten or stabbed.
The chance of someone pulling a knife on you are low but not zero.
Drinking a beer in a random bar there is a chance you get knifed just for standing next to a random stranger as well.
Since Gevlon is about as polarizing as it gets outside of CODE I can understand why he wouldn't show up for fanfest (doesn't sound as if social events like these interest him that much anyway.)
And while there are plenty of people that might not like Gevlon, surely there would be enough people (even or maybe especially, goons,) who would love to buy him a drink to thank him for entertaining us.
Depending on how serious these threats are I assume Rixx already took RL measures like contacting police and CCP.
I know that when I read CODE miner tears I am almost tempted to gank someone just to report them for RL threats should they issue them in their tears.
@Anonymous: "if you went to fanfest I'd be more worried about what you would do to other people than what others would do to you."
Funny how you don't see how it is supporting my point.
Hint: You believe that there is at least one dangerous EVE player who could show up at fanfest.
Vandalizing a monument != stabbing someone.
People say things online they would never say to your face, and if someone wanted to really harm someone, it is relatively trivial to find out who someone is, so why wait til fanfest where there is a big audience?
Perhaps I should stay indoors permanently, in case some bad guy does something to me? I should not go to a social event? I should not meet up with people I have wanted to meet for years?
Is that not just what the trolls want?
"I don't know how you feel, but 23% chance to meet a murderer isn't comforting."
Your math is not correct because you forgot that the .23 chance was calculated for 5000 people. The proper result is 0.004%. In addition to this I think the real chance is even lower because I guess that the USA statictics contains mostly "professional" criminals who are not typically EVE players.
Karel
"Vandalizing a monument != stabbing someone."
With the same logic:
"burning books and breaking shop windows != killing jews"
"If we assume there will be 5K people in Fanfest, you'll meet 0.23 murderer, 1.35 rapist, 5.65 robber and 12.11 brawler. "
Isn't that not applicable to every day working environment, (with the exception of working in correctional facilities) ?
In everyday situations:
- you don't meet 5000 people
- you don't meet with many new people (my coworkers haven't committed any violent crime, so seeing them again and again isn't a risk)
- you don't meet intoxicated people (assuming you don't go to places where alcohol is served)
- you don't meet people who filled your inbox with hate and insults
""burning books and breaking shop windows != killing jews""
allthough book-burnings and anti-semitism have a very long tradition in europe. they do not necessarily correlate.
other than that, i support raz' argumentation. your reasons of not going to fanfest are way different than jixx' - you might want to consider that while rixx seems to be a really nice and positive guy who isn't running his blog on a "you are all idiots, you are all doing it wrong, you are all morons and slackers, etc pp"-platform.
while he indeed would have to deal with some lunatics who might really hate him for reasons, you yourself have aggregated so much game related hate onto you person that, while i don't think anyone hates you for your rl.person, you indeed would have to deal with a lot of criticism - and we all know that dealing with criticism is not your strenght.
most people who committed a crime in the usa were sentenced to prison, therefore are inable to leave the country.
here in germany we have that "tradition" of 1st may riots, though heavily policed in the last years, at least in my city, often shop windows are being broken during these "riots" - they are more some kind of gathering with a light police brawl :) anyway, whenever a shopwindow breaks, can i assume that a person of jewish heritage dies?
As a USA citizen, you seem to forget that at least half of the people there are european.
And crime rates in europe are much lower then in the USA.
Also you seem to forget that iceland is an island, not easy to get weapons there... .
You can't buy any gun in the malls like in the usa.
I've been to fanfest twice and, just nope.
Most people don't take EVE seriously once they log off Gevlon.
At fanfest you'll see Goons getting happily drunk with NC. You'll see gankers having a merry time with miners. Griefers having civil conversations with hardcore carebears over a shared diner.
Because "EVE is real" but not in the way the marketing adds make you think, but in the sense of the connections that people make through this game.
People who 'hate' each other in game for in game political/ideological reasons are all just a bunch of nerds with a common interest out of game at fanfest there to have a holiday and party and converse with like minded folk.
Sure sometimes they do stupid shit like with monument, drunk people do stupid things vOv But they do those everywhere not just at fanfest.
Your assertions about the safety of Fanfest make me sad. I've attended three of them, and will be going to my fourth next week. Every single Fanfest has been a happy celebration of the EVE Online community. Security and safety at Fanfest are the last things any attendee needs to worry about.
I'm delighted that Rixx is attending. There needs to be more of us in the 95th percentile of the age distribution of EVE Online players attending Fanfest. Grey hair always adds a distinguished tone to balance out the youngster tresses and beards of the more energetic attendees. :-)
Taking your logic to it's inevitable conclusion, Gevlon, one shouldn't ever leave their home. This is a depressing outlook. You really don't know what fun and camaraderie you are missing at an event like Fanfest. Come join us - you'd be surprised how even some of the worst space-pilot enemies get along when they meet in Real Life at Fanfest. Seriously.
"They probably feel bad about their words and be genuinely sorry, but that won't help you."
No. If you talk shit you can't "genuinely" be anything but a M&S idiot of a human being. Simple as that. All the social glue after a negative event is just to save their ass in front of other socials. which is irrational. If they are true to their word they should stick to it to the end.
I had enough bullies in my life. And once it went to far as always and confronted by authority they all bend over and lied to safe their asses.
Yes. all it takes is one idiot. That is why we can't have nice things.
Still. this is eve. like the 4chan meetups where high advocates and heavy users of /b/ meet. nothing did happen.
@Kaeda: I'm sure that most people are like you described. But would you bet with your life that all of them are? I sure won't.
And yes, drunken people are idiots everywhere. This is why I avoid every place where alcohol is served.
@Neville: you can of course leave your home, but you should avoid bad neighborhoods and places of mass drunkenness.
The truth about fanfest is that it is populated by middle of the road nerdish affluent white men, probably the least dangerous species in the world despite how they pretend on the internet. There's good reasons for not going but fearing for personal safety isn't one of them.
"In everyday situations:
- you don't meet 5000 people
- you don't meet with many new people (my coworkers haven't committed any violent crime, so seeing them again and again isn't a risk)
- you don't meet intoxicated people (assuming you don't go to places where alcohol is served)
- you don't meet people who filled your inbox with hate and insults"
just one thing to mention
im working as a tram driver in Budapest
- i meet thousands of ppl everyday
- most of them are new, never met them before (some of them commited crimes before. and thats a fact. just think about district 8 and 9 for example)
- some of them are intoxicated, aggressive. they dont respect me, other ppl or the law
- some of them hate us. im not recieving threat mails, those are real life threats, face to face
so you are suggesting that i should quit my job and stay home, cuz my life is in danger?
How many of the 5k expected to be at Fanfest are from the US?
How many of the 100K excerpt you mention were EVE players?
@Anonymous: The 9/11 and the Charlie Hebdo attackers belong to the demographics you mention. This demographic group swarm to Turkey to cross the border and sign up for the Islamic State. They filled the groups like IRA, ETA and Red Army Faction in the seventies-eighties.
@Tram driver: YES. There is a reason why the Hungarian government created a law specifically to protect you and the likes.
@Darkblad: I understand that EVE Fanfest goers don't have the same background as the general population. But anyone sending death threats over the interned is considered "dangerous guy" in my book.
Understanding the world is a dangerous place is a useful place, everything we do in life is a calculated risk, being conscious of that calculation avoids unnecessary risk above our personal threshold. It's what separates an extreme sport specialist from a drunk guy going down a hill in a shopping trolley.
The debate in this thread is twofold, firstly what is the risk level of going to fanfest and secondly what is your personal acceptable risk level.
The mathematics of the risk level you present is floored when not compared to a base level. You also should state your acceptable risk level as it would seem that you are comfortable leaving your house.
I would suggest that looking at previous number of injuries at fanfest as a trend would be a positive step, as controversial people attend all the time (Mittani for example). I would also say there is proof that experiencing and overcoming a higher risk environment leads to an endorphin release which is why some people go for these experiences.
"Funny how you don't see how it is supporting my point.
Hint: You believe that there is at least one dangerous EVE player who could show up at fanfest."
I think "dangerous" is a strong term. I think there's a risk of an unstable individual being at fanfest but I doubt there's a risk of anyone becoming violent and succeeding in attacking another player. I'd say there's a great deal more chance that a plane will crash en route than a player being murdered by another player.
With your stats by the way, you claimed a "23% chance to meet a murderer". There's a number of issue with that. First it's US stats, yet an internatonal convention and crime rates vary. More importantly though, that's out of 100k people how many will be murderers. I'm betting that means "in their lifetime". So what are the chances of not only meeting someone capable of murder, but meeting someone during the few days that they decide to actually commit that act.
I truly believe there is no significant risk to Rixx at fanfest, certainly not enough to change his plans. If he is going to change his plans for that reason, he'd probably want to consider all of the other life threatening risks of flying to an active volcanic island.
""Vandalizing a monument != stabbing someone."
With the same logic:
"burning books and breaking shop windows != killing jews""
You are correct. Burning books is not the same as killing jews. You realise that it wasn't the book burning people were worried about, right? Vandalism isn't symbolic of murder.
But Rixx has to show up to Fanfest. His line of posters is premiering at Fanfest! Not a joke, either, CCP just confirmed they'll be selling Rixx Javix posters.
I've felt in more danger walking across the campus quad at my university located in rural Illinois than I ever did in Reykjavik. All he really needs to do is watch the drinking establishments and he'll be fine.
*sigh* alcohol drinking. again.
One of the peak activities for M&S. It doesn't matter if they have millions, claim to be the top notch enlightened monk or be the top elite science people ... as soon as they touch alcohol they lose any reputation and respect in my mind.
The absolute worst drug. Only consumed by idiots to push their stupidity multiplier trough the roof. Includes those status symbol folk sipping badly tasting alcoholic liquid from 3k$ bottles.
It's expensive, tastes like shit, people talk shit about it or talk shit under the influence of it. should be banned + people genetically altered so they die if consuming alcohol. And yes I have a hard time loving Hitchens.
Considering most violent criminals tend toward the lower end of the economic spectrum, and the eclipse has jacked the price of Icelandair tickets this year to the point where some people are paying over $1000 just to get to fanfest (saying nothing of the hotel, food, or drinks - or the event itself)...
Let's just say that the fanfest population self-selects for less violent behavior, and more jackassery.
:@Anon 17:37
"*sigh* alcohol drinking. again."
Some of us enjoy drinking alcohol. Some enjoy eating fatty foods. Some enjoy smoking. Some enjoy extreme sports and the adrenaline rush.
Getting on your high horse like you're somehow better than other people because you choose not to drink and that your respect is something to be cherished because of it is arrogant to the extreme.
@Arrendis: then I guess last year vandals arrived swimming.
I feel like I should respond to this post.
Let me be clear that while it is true that I continue to be the subject of some negative attention from certain parties, details of which I cannot elaborate, this fact in no way has hindered or caused undo concern with either myself or my wife. We discussed the potential and both felt confident that the risks involved were minimal or non-existent, and have continued our preparations as if they did not exist.
I am not, nor have I ever been, a fearful person. I take reasonable risks and live my life to the fullest, and always have. No amount of threats, both real or virtual, are going to stop me from attending my first Fanfest. I have been thru too much, both personally and professionally, in order to have this opportunity. And I will not tolerate any "haters" barring me from enjoying myself among my friends.
Life is full of risks. Anything can happen. We take this upon ourselves from the moment we are born into this world. Nothing changes, only the ways in which we face our fears. That power comes from choice. And I choose to live my life to the fullest. I have always made that choice and will continue to do so. As always, I conduct myself with intelligence, common sense and the confidence that comes from a vast sea of personal experience.
And mostly, I will treat everyone I meet at Fanfest as my friend.
Rixx Javix
Telling someone not to have an experience because you are a worried about statistics is the most arrogant thing i've heard you say for awhile.
Have you ever been in a near death situation or lost an elderly relative who gave you perspective on life? Did you decide "right now that I got through nearly being dead im going to stop doing everything i did before because i nearly died"
Did your elderly relative tell you to stay at home because the world my snatch you up and end your life.
Its arrogant because you don't have the fogiest whats on the other side. I personally think nothing.
PLEASE PLEASE don't closter your self up in safe situations. Walk into new situations with your eyes open enjoying the adrenaline surge it gives you. It can be as little as talking to someone on a bus or as crazy as walking into a town who don't speak your language and having a great day with them.
If you don't you will still die and you will have done nothing before you did. Nothing you will look back on and smile about getting through it anyway.
All the best.
MR T
Is this a bad time to mention Suicidegate 2012?
I believe that it is risky for a blogger to go to Fanfest.
Rixx, listen to your wife, going to Fanfest is a bad idea!
The argument that Gevlon provides is bullshit imo. The chance that something like this will happen is insignificant.
But there are some risk when you link your real identity with an avatar.
I do not know if your real identity is public knowledge, but if it isn't, you have something to lose.
You might not want to associate your name with a videogame like EVE. Employers, friends, family could end up reading your blog content.
And while murder is very unlikely, there could be other backlash from haters.
The haters might also target your wife for being associated to you, you might get physical hate mail or people could decide to pull pranks on you.
But then again, you most likely have a good time, meet new friends and do some networking.
@Gevlon.
I do not know the whole story. But I assume that these people wanted to vandalize that monument regardless, and then decided to frame it on you.
Vandalization does not equal murder luckily!
Using country wide probabilities to infer X criminals of some sort will be at fanfest is just nonsense. Beyond some estimate such as "between 0 and some" you've no idea how many "murders" will be there. Even with more information at best you'd get some mean and variance not a single number.
And I don't think, in general, your attitude reflects a strong degree of personal security. How stupid, or weak, other people are has nothing to do with you. It's a fine thing if you just don't want to go, or socialize in general, but don't cook up some baloney too rationalize social avoidance, just say no thank you and be done with it.
This post reads like a forwarded email from grandma. It says little about the subject and more about the fear and ignorance of the author.
Many players, some of them more well-known and disliked than Gevlon, have previously attended Fanfest with, mega-hangovers aside, negligible ill effects. In fact, many players have testified about how they had a pleasant experience while meeting players with which they have had significant in-game conflict!
Hell, it would probably be safer for Gevlon to visit Iceland than it is to stay in Hungary where there are so many vampires. In fact, I recently got an email about the risks of vampires from grandma...
I think you must have agoraphobia to reduce your decision to go to an event just because statistics says there "might" be bad peoples, but bad people and murderers / rapists are everywhere and not just at fanfest, I do hope you get out of your house once in a while. Meeting online friends in a con is super cool, its something you should do at least once in your life.
@Manserk: I give speeches on conferences front of hundreds of people.
I don't have agoraphobia. I have drunk-vandal-deaththreatening-phobia.
You may give speeches in front of hundreds, this does not preclude you from having a phobia of being in large social gatherings.
I do not socialise at all, I hate it, but I happily give a speech in front of hundreds of people, then slip away afterwards.
And yes, window breaking and book burning != killing jews.
Have some people who have broken windows also killed jews? Sure.
But then,some people who have done bad things have done pretty much any activity.
The level of hyperbole in your posts is usually high, and entertaining, but, the level of fear shown in this one is high even for you.
WRT the monument..even if CCP had believed it was you, it would have been trivial to check if you were at fanfest, and, even if they had not believed you, they would have banned you from Eve....tell me how getting banned from a game is equivalent to being attacked.
I have never been banned from a game, but I have had someone try to kill me, and, I suspect that getting banned from a game is nbd in comparison.
Post a Comment