Saturday, January 5, 2013

Dead morons of the week

Back to the unique selling point of EVE: the morons here don't walk away lolling from their failure but with a loss that can cost $1000 to replace if one chooses to buy ISK via buying PLEX. Every listed moron here is over $150 loss.
  • 7B Moros. Besides his pricetag what really makes him moron is that there was a friendly carrier so he could refit from tracking to tank+DPS. Also his rigs are just bad.
  • Shuttle with 18 PLEX in Jita.
  • 35M (about $1000) Aeon supercarrier. It belonged to TEST alliance, so did its killers. Spying with bad.
  • Why did this carrier hauled 5B cargo in (bad) ratting fit? Or why did he rat with cargo? Questions, question...
  • Same thing, this time with 4B cargo
  • 1, 2, 3 Fatal Ascension supercarriers ($1000 each) in lowsec. Away from home. Near PL. Whoring on killmails.
  • Hey, one more supercarrier in lowsec.
  • Hint: lowsec is not your sov, anyone can show up. Pandemic Legion is infamous of being "anyone".
  • Wardecced JF in highsec.
  • Another wardecced JF in highsec.
  • Yet another wardecced JF in highsec.
  • Losing a JF in lowsec isn't necessarily stupid. Losing it in a system that isn't neighboring continuous highsec on the other hand is quite stupid.
  • Someone tried to copy MasL's failure. Bad idea for 7.5B.
  • How to lose 74B ($2000) by being stupid? Instead of logging off your titan, try to place it into a small tower shield. Since it did not fit in, it was bumped and killed.
  • You rarely see Rorquals out in the belt. Especially not in lowsec. With horrible fit.
Thanks for all the fish morons, see you next week! I'm sure you won't fail me to provide yet another collection of proof of your idiotism.

15 comments:

Anonymous said...

I've pretty much commented on every single "morons of the week" post you've made and this time is going to be no different. However, this time instead of pointing out where you are wrong I am going to ask some questions:

Why do you do this? what possible purpose do these "morons of the week" posts serve?

How do you conclude people are morons? they do things differently to you? they don't conform to what you see as being the right way to play the game (and often you are demonstrably wrong)?

Do you see this as somehow helping them or are you simply doing this to feel superior? be honest now...

Do you honestly think you are superior to other players in eve? More intellegent? Have a better understanding than other people? what is it in your mind that qualifies you to call people morons?

Gevlon said...

They lost up to $1000 in easily avoidable mistakes. They are dumb.

The point of the posts is to show the people how many dumb people are around us.

tangurena said...

Probably around the end of February, I'll be getting a Rorqual.

What would have been a better fit?

Generally, when there is a "this is a shitfit" remark, I try to look at some of them and try to figure out what's bad, but with capital ships, I've got no idea what's good, bad or fugly.

As for the Titan with the butt sticking out of the POS shield, I'm surprised they didn't try to board it and fly off with it, but I guess if your corp/alliance are killboard whores, then a cheap Titan kill outweighs the benefit of having one.

Coralina said...

Remember Dungeon Finder at the start of Cataclysm?

There was a theory being perpetuated by a minority of forum users during Wrath that if you make content harder so that players were punished for failing, those players would learn from their mistakes and improve.

What actually happened when this theory was tested was that players didn't improve. Or if they did they were simply replaced by an infinite supply of M&S.

What happened next has been well documented - the M&S destroyed the game for everyone else by rendering the Dungeon Finder system next to useless.

Whilst Gevlon promotes EVE due to its apparently harsh punishment of M&S, it is interesting is it not that after an entire decade of harsh punishment there is no end to the existence of bad players.

This is not a criticism of EVE or a criticism of Gevlons beliefs.

I am merely using it as further evidence against the theory that harder content with harsher punishments leads to better quality players.

Druur Monakh said...

@Gevlon: Question: How would you efficiently supply a low-sec POS far away from continguous hi-sec?

Anonymous said...

tangurea where did you get the idea the titan was unpiloted?

As for gevlon what proof do you have that what you've been doing with these loss posts have had any effect on the playerbase? If what you're doing isn't changing anyone's mind, then what's the point?

Camo said...

Coralina: "I am merely using it as further evidence against the theory that harder content with harsher punishments leads to better quality players."

The point is that you can't make any game harsh enough to get people to realize that they do stupid things.
It doesn't even work completely in real life! Well at least you die there if you totally screw up.
Technically you could tune a game towards that kind of difficulty but you would be without any customer in no time.
So toning it down yields more paying customers and more content for those that punish them for being stupid.

Anonymous said...

how did they lose $1000? you cannot convert in game currency back into real world currency. Unless they bought the in game currency with plex that they used a credit card to purchase there is no connection whatsoever to real world value. Since you cannot prove that they did this your argument is invalid.

What about the rest of my questions?

Or are your justifications simply a thinly veiled form of bullying stemming from your enormous superiority complex?

Gevlon said...

How does them being dumb has to do anything with me?

The statement "they are dumb" stands alone. Disprove it if you can.

Anonymous said...

Your statement "they are dumb" does not stand alone. Also it is your assertion not mine, thus the burden of proof is with you.

I asked some rather simple questions to which you have not answered adequately:

* Why do you do this?
* What possible purpose do these "morons of the week" posts serve?
* How do you conclude people are morons?
* Is it because they do things differently to you?
* Is it because they do not conform to what you see as being the right way to play the game (and often you are demonstrably wrong - I'll add, more often than not)?
* Do you see this as somehow helping them or are you doing this to feel superior?
* Do you honestly think that you are superior to other players in eve?
* More intelligent?
* have a better understanding than other people?
* What is it in your mind that qualifies you to call people morons?

Gevlon said...

* Why do you do this?
- Because I think people are too tolerant with morons and slackers and it makes the world economy suffer. We would be better off without them.

* What possible purpose do these "morons of the week" posts serve?
- Alert the people of the magnitude of stupidity behind the failure of people.

* How do you conclude people are morons?
- Are you trolling? How can someone who is NOT a moron do these things?

* Is it because they do things differently to you?
- No, it is because they do things differently AND fail. (losing a $1000 ship is pretty big failure)

* Is it because they do not conform to what you see as being the right way to play the game (and often you are demonstrably wrong - I'll add, more often than not)?
- Again: the first step of being moron is to fail. I cannot qualify one a moron without failure, no matter how much I disagree with their methods. Did I ever called TEST moron? They so do not conform with me that they kicked me and I still suggest people to JOIN them.

* Do you see this as somehow helping them or are you doing this to feel superior?
- I want to help the non-morons who are now supporting the morons and slackers. They need to see that the M&S is unworthy of support.

* Do you honestly think that you are superior to other players in eve?
- "Other players" in general: no. Them? Yes.

* More intelligent?
- I guess even a mediocre 12 years old is more intelligent than the M&S.

* have a better understanding than other people?
- Obviously, but again, it's not a hard thing to do. You are commenting on a site, meaning you are READING in your free time. So you are also in this "superior" group.

* What is it in your mind that qualifies you to call people morons?
- They ARE morons. It doesn't need me to be more "special" to call it out like saying "the water is wet".

Anonymous said...

@Gevlon, Different anon here

the reason it has anything to do with you is the exigence, or the situation that causes a person to take action, in this case writing. You are right, "they are dumb" cannot be disproved, except in the case of the Mannar loss, but like-wise it can also not be proven, there is simply not enough information, you ignore the very real option that both parties were smart but one simply was smarter. because of this people ask you why they are considered dumb, to have you explain your stance so an actual debate can occur. your arguments are very lazy and come off as arbitrary, containing no logic or reason and simply containing your biases dressed as fact. this means that you are not being clear in your words communication is a two way street. you are not communicating well, since you not only have people who can not understand things that seem basic to you. it is also worth noting your logic is not sound. the argument in formal logic is as follows

P1: If x then y.
P2: Is x
C: Is y

X being an easily avoided mistake.
Y being stupid.

to be fair there is logic at work the problem is the second premise by any standard, and I would argue that the first premise, is flawed but that aside from the point. If either premise is false the the logic is unsound, and considering you have no way of proving that these things were easily avoidable, and likewise that they were not easily avoidable, your logic remains unsound in limbo. at least on case is not people being stupid though so at least one case is out and out unsound. you put forward this argument explain your terms,and give your evidence. Also burden of evidence falls on the one making the claim; you have provided none. you place the burden on the ones questioning the gaps in your argument.

As for the Mannar indecent the group has holdings in the region, and Mannar is an ice field system and the area is generally pretty good. While I can't remember if it is a system where they have a POS I know they have some there or they were simply removing resources from the system that isn't stupid, risky yes, but not necessarily stupid.

I have been writing this for some time, since before your last response, so now I feel I should address it. you have yet to prove anything. You claim your definition is true with out giving solid proof( while $1000 is a large loss there is no evidence that it was by stupidity). you claim there is support of stupid behavior in these loses, else why even use them, how so? as it stand in formal logic the argument is
P1:
P2: is supported
C: therefore stupidity is supported.

For the definition of a Moron, you give two arguments for the first they are morons because they fail, this is a correlation causation fallacy there are other reasons for failure, and second you are arguing they are X because they are X, X being morons this is a tautology which is utterly useless in logic.

you are making claims with no evidence and unsound logic. stepping away from the formal logic perspective for a moment, I have found that some of the links in these posts only show your own short comings, particularly in the case of solo PvP ships, which while more expensive than I would like, have a rather obvious purpose.

back to point you say you want to stop support for the morons, how does this type of post even do that your argument is as follows.

P1: if x then y
P2: x
C: therefore y

X being morons.
Y being unsupportable.

once again the flaw is in the premises why is P1 true and is P2 true?

No explanation or proof is given for either of these; as such they cannot be considered true, once again causing the argument to be unsound.

you have neither proof nor logic on your side.

Anonymous said...

M&S are r selected and others are K selected, so there will always be more and more M&S even with harsher penalties.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R/K_selection_theory

Anonymous said...

Because I think people are too tolerant with morons and slackers and it makes the world economy suffer. We would be better off without them.

People losing ships in internet spaceships impact the world economy? Assuming you mean that these people must be morons in real life and their moronic behavior means we'd be better off without them - are you advocating some sort of real world moron purge? do you have any evidence to back up the premise that "morons" in general are the cause of the worlds economic problems? I seem to recall most of the evidence pointing to unchecked capitalism and greed being the problem, not those born with inferior intellect or not given the opportunity of education.

Alert the people of the magnitude of stupidity behind the failure of people.

So you have taken it upon yourself to provide this service? Thank you so much. Please provide some supporting evidence as to the specific harm these people are doing to my game, and the world economy at large.

Are you trolling? How can someone who is NOT a moron do these things?

Not trolling. There are many reasons to fit ships expensive, all of which are justifiable (yes, even 20 billion isk machs). The moros that you failed to link perhaps couldn't refit because he was outside of refitting range at the time? perhaps his enemies bumped him out of range and killed him? You have concluded that his ship was expensive and there was a carrier thus he should have refit without knowing the specifics of the engagement outside of the kill mails.

No, it is because they do things differently AND fail. (losing a $1000 ship is pretty big failure)

Please provide proof these ships cost $1000. No, simply working out the theoretical value of the isk if it were possible to turn isk into USD wont suffice. You need to prove that these ships were infact paid for with real money (via direct credit card -> plex -> sale -> purchase supercap) transaction - otherwise they are worth space pixel money which the pilots could have come by via any number of other means. I will go as far as to suggest that assigning real world value to internet spaceships is "moronic" as such assignment cannot be made or supported.

Again: the first step of being moron is to fail. I cannot qualify one a moron without failure, no matter how much I disagree with their methods. Did I ever called TEST moron? They so do not conform with me that they kicked me and I still suggest people to JOIN them.

You fail at reading kill mails, several times per week. You then refuse to accept people explaining to you why you are wrong and instead stick to your same old arguments.

You fail at statistical analysis also. Such failures have been pointed out and still no correction to your article.

You fail at any form of social assimilation, that is why TEST threw you out.

Moron on 3 counts Gevlon?

I want to help the non-morons who are now supporting the morons and slackers. They need to see that the M&S is unworthy of support.


Lets assume I grant you that everyone in your moron of the week posts are in fact morons - how do you think those who are not morons are supporting them exactly? The non-morons in your argument have deprived them of "$1000 ships"...surely this is the opposite of support?

"Other players" in general: no. Them? Yes.

Your understanding of fitting is often obviously inferior to your so-called morons. How could anyone forget your suggestions that shield moros be replaced with phoenix in pulsars? or your constant berating of 20b isk solo machs that you couldn't possibly hope to understand?

They ARE morons. It doesn't need me to be more "special" to call it out like saying "the water is wet".

you have failed to provide any evidence of their idiocy or moronic behavior. That really only leaves your 'expert' opinion. I was asking what qualified you to make a statement that they were morons and this was your reply? riiight.

Anonymous said...

Unrelated, but highly relevant for you:

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=3677

Over 90% of social security money doesn't go to actual leeches: It goes to disabled people, old people and working people with shitty jobs. Seems like a bit of a waste of time to try to screw those poor bastards out of their pensions when there are much bigger fish to fry (such as many big companies paying less than 1% taxes overall by means of financial trickery).

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