tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post7676881725918716002..comments2024-02-27T14:44:07.868+01:00Comments on Greedy goblin: Alchemy summaryGevlonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07072766785893313616noreply@blogger.comBlogger41125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-52157328983441848162009-08-22T11:22:35.819+02:002009-08-22T11:22:35.819+02:00I think people are missing the point on Alchemy ne...I think people are missing the point on Alchemy needing new products: if there was a new flask of awesome that 100% of the players used several a day, and alchemists learned it at the trainer, then there would not be a lot of profit in it.<br /><br />Profit comes from buyers but also limiting sellers: complicated/intricate (inscription), limited patterns (BoP in Kara/Sunwell), cooldowns (tailoring ew/sw/ms c/d, epic transmute, j/c daily). My feeling is BoE patterns tend to just transfer g to the pattern seller. Even if the pattern is very rare, that usually just increase the pattern cost. Say you spend the 10kg to buy a new 245 pattern today. I don't see How you going to recoup that.<br /><br />In fact, a new Flask of Awesome would draw more people into alchemy, so the average profits might even decline.<br /><br />If you make money on timing the potion market - that is not alchemy that is trading and non-alchemists could do that, although it is low margin. Although I have an alchemist, I find the market trading on fluctuations works about as well on frost lotus as the flasks themselves.<br /><br />Certainly the person who was making 600g on getting others to use their transmutes (why would anyone do that btw???) is not making money as an alchemist. you could be a JC/scribe and still hire the gullible to undersell their c/d. <br /><br />On my server the EFire+SRuby is 50-60 and CR is 150-160 uncut, another 10-20g if Runed, so the alchemist is making about 100g/day - say 130g/day counting procs but not a/h fees. ( BTW, if someone is producing more than 200g/day in flasks, they are better off *not* being transmutation specialist. )<br /><br />BTW, You Netherweave bag pros, what are your economics - 4g/stack or slightly less for cloth plus thread and bags sell for 6.5 to 7. and enough competition so there are some relisting fees,Haguhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03726885305104254286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-7493118685961800712009-08-21T02:10:44.954+02:002009-08-21T02:10:44.954+02:00Actually, Gevlon, I think you missed the major mar...Actually, Gevlon, I think you missed the major market for diamond transmutes after the patch: Jewelcrafters who'd levelled to 430 or so jewelcrafting who needed to reach 450 JC to prospect titanium or cut epic gems.<br /><br />It's possible to reach 440 JC or so by cutting rare gems of various colors, but you need to cut at least 10 or so diamonds of one type or the other to get the last 10 points in JC. I'd power-levelled Jewelcrafting on my main in 3.1 for raiding because of the self-only benefits, and I'd stopped at 433 or so because there wasn't any benefit for me to go higher. (I have a dedicated JC alt with almost all the patterns.) When 3.1 hit, I ended up cutting about 18-19 diamonds to max my JC skill on my main so I could get more epic gem cuts.<br /><br />I expect a lot of these gems got cut into "unprofitable" gems just for skill levels. Fortunately, I had the tanking meta gem from a HoL run, so at least I was able to make some profit from power-levelling.Argenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07908845315588176801noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-10243864491533162502009-08-20T19:35:16.637+02:002009-08-20T19:35:16.637+02:00Quote
"BUT, especially if you are a raider, a...Quote<br />"BUT, especially if you are a raider, alchemy "saves" you money, therefore indirectly you make money. You use %50 less flasks/elixirs than non-alchemists, so even if you buy your flasks from AH you still spend less money on them."<br /><br />That is a really poor point in alchemy's favor. At most that's saving you about 30g *maybe* 60g a few times a week. Lets say you raid 4 days a week and save 60g a raid night that's only 240g per week. <br /><br />You could much more easily take up another profession make a lot more money than that without breaking a sweat.Yazilliclickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02657214520246273266noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-14210053591029845382009-08-20T09:28:35.078+02:002009-08-20T09:28:35.078+02:00Most of what goblins seem to exploit are the lesse...Most of what goblins seem to exploit are the lesser niches, for example, Netherweave bags, Frostweave are far better, but i can sell the cloth for more then the bag! and Enchanters +8 Stats over +10 Why? because +8 is cheep, costs notihng and +10 costs tons..<br /><br />They made 2 major nerfs to alchemy that have destoryed it as profitable, #1 Battle Vrs Gaurdian Elixer, There was a day in time where you would and could use as many elixer buffs with your flask buff as you wanted thought you needed, But now its a choice, do i use Flask of frost wrym, or do i use a pair of elixers, and i cant have 2 Guardian elixers...<br /><br />Change #2, they changed the Shared cool down on potions, So now when i use a mana potion, i have to wait until im out of combat and 2 minutes before i can use another, durring a 15 minute fight you might use 3 or 4 mana pots, And at the begining you might use a small one to top you off, now its only used for Oh shot moments.<br /><br />And another change, they removed the viablity of protection potions, not only do they share this cool down timer with more valuable healing and mana pots but the effect lasts 2 minutes. Which 2 minutes of an onyxia type fight do you want fire protection for?<br /><br />Any one ever used a Frost resistance potion to help them finish off Hodir?melnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-24330482929510517782009-08-20T05:02:39.436+02:002009-08-20T05:02:39.436+02:00I Sell about 5-10 of the +Crit meta gems each week...I Sell about 5-10 of the +Crit meta gems each week (Chaotic Skyflare I think it is called) for around 60g, after buying the raw gem for 30g.<br /><br />While all other meta gems crash around me, this meta still sells consistantly well for me.<br /><br />And since 3.2 I've easily sold 50 or more of these gems.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-19482922779505369712009-08-20T03:18:27.562+02:002009-08-20T03:18:27.562+02:00Good post gevlon, an interesting post since you...Good post gevlon, an interesting post since you've put together 2 things most of us here are interested in: wow and econ. Interesting to take a profession and analyze the type of products(one-time use or consumable) and the type of person interested(MS or non) btw, I was seeing some of your troll posts from this weekend complaining how much time you spend on AH< now I know you say you spend much time MAKING your products, but how often are you monitoring and undercutting??? shouldn't that be a part of your cost when you compare your work to farming?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-18851221527437451592009-08-20T03:08:00.846+02:002009-08-20T03:08:00.846+02:00Very interesting post and analysis, thanks for the...Very interesting post and analysis, thanks for the writeup.<br /><br />My main is an alchemist and always will be because I think it is a fun profession but I did notice that the profit margin is not particularly great... ah well... I have played with it a little but in the end I am not a superhardcore money-maker so it's okay =PPikehttp://aspectofthehare.netnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-21444936272801609082009-08-20T01:53:31.466+02:002009-08-20T01:53:31.466+02:00You "usually" get 2 gems?? that's a ...You "usually" get 2 gems?? that's a better streak of luck than most get then!!it's a proc chance so unless you have some mysterious system that effects game mechanics, I wouldn't rely too much on the income from those "usual" procs. Currently if I get a double proc twice in 7 days, it's not a bad week, 3 times I'll be made up with. Me thinks your "usually" is more than a slight exaggeration!Aosothnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-35277487599775516392009-08-19T23:37:29.889+02:002009-08-19T23:37:29.889+02:00With about 10 minutes of work, I'm clearing ea...With about 10 minutes of work, I'm clearing easily 1k/day with just the epic transmutes, as an xmute master I usually get 2 gems per xmute, have them cut for a small fee and post in the AH for about 300g each, in about an hour they are gone. But why stop there, I pay for xmutes from other alchs, the mats are the most expensive for scarlet ruby + eternal fire = cardinal ruby, bam another 600g, I could keep going but I think at the moment the epic gem market is the spot to clean up.Garyphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04880857020762073430noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-73802575588428033542009-08-19T23:05:01.246+02:002009-08-19T23:05:01.246+02:00Gevlon did not say alchemy wasn't profitable, ...Gevlon did not say alchemy wasn't profitable, just that it my not be as profitable as some other professions due to a lack of diversity of high-demand products.<br /><br />But that lack of diversity also means the alchemy market is simple to enter and not as time consuming as managing glyphs. A few products which sell steadily, little time invested, return is decent to pay for raiding once/week, and I can make my own flasks as well.<br /><br />Fits my playstyle nicely.Bristalnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-90367286884397743492009-08-19T22:06:03.329+02:002009-08-19T22:06:03.329+02:00@Vlad Aerie:
The addons I use are:
Lil Sparky&#...@Vlad Aerie:<br /> The addons I use are:<br />Lil Sparky's Workshop - lists glyph prices from auctioneer<br />Armory - lists total number of an item on any character<br />Auctioneer - allows automated price check and posting of glyphs.<br /><br />There seems to be a bug with Armory where the item number on toon (a) is forgotten if you craft on toon (a). So, I store glyphs on toon (b) and craft on toon (a).Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-19494430289791722522009-08-19T19:40:08.858+02:002009-08-19T19:40:08.858+02:00Gevlon, you have overlooked one of the most profit...Gevlon, you have overlooked one of the most profitable transmutes for alchemy: Primal Might. You can read more about my success <a href="http://mobgold.blogspot.com/2009/08/tip-of-day-primal-might.html" rel="nofollow"> Here </a>Nuisancehttp://mobgold.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-293754726495994432009-08-19T19:23:16.954+02:002009-08-19T19:23:16.954+02:00@Vlad aerie
The investment of time will be more ...@Vlad aerie <br /><br />The investment of time will be more than worth it. In the last two weeks I changed the use of one addon, I now make 12 - 15k weekly in my Glyph business. The only thing I changed was an addon.Kauzmohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13766971722568240302noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-61451949839839247962009-08-19T19:05:23.587+02:002009-08-19T19:05:23.587+02:00@Gev,
When you say its more profiable than far...@Gev,<br /> When you say its more profiable than farming, you lost me on that. Where you refering to any farming? or just herbalism? As mining i can make 5k in 3 days, doing only a few hours a day, with minimal effort. besides the mind melting repetivness of it.Struttnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-37074791319384782762009-08-19T18:28:19.209+02:002009-08-19T18:28:19.209+02:00It's true. The same happens with alchemy on my...It's true. The same happens with alchemy on my realm (and with almost all the professions, for that matter).<br /><br />The problem is that my realm is full of morons that think "If I farm it myself it's free!" Damn can't these people realize that time = money?<br /><br />But I'm glad to know alchemy is still more profitable than grinding elementals.Sidnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-82389517721935543542009-08-19T18:00:37.531+02:002009-08-19T18:00:37.531+02:00Alchemy is definitely a mature market. On my serv...Alchemy is definitely a mature market. On my server it is better to play the market surges. You get a pretty good feel for sales patterns - when the flasks sell and for how much and when. Once you have that you can buy on the lows and hold to sell later when the glut is gone. The ebb and flow of frost lotus availability provides those gaps. My most troublesome competition is with one particular player who sits at the AH from 8:30PMish to 9AMish server time repeatedly undercutting flask postings. He is in the gem market as well doing the same thing.Willowbearnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-25712724670657944882009-08-19T17:19:22.421+02:002009-08-19T17:19:22.421+02:00I still make good profit, but there are several go...I still make good profit, but there are several goblin in inscription on my server and I dont always have the time to keep undercutting them.<br /><br />I am still making 10-14k a week, but it is a far cry less than the 40-50k I was making a few weeks ago with little competition.<br /><br />I dont even bother with my other trade skills unless I am leveling an alt thru Outlands and I make netherweave bags.Darraxushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09290390808933294129noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-82984310708536587732009-08-19T16:33:14.934+02:002009-08-19T16:33:14.934+02:00I found your comments on mature markets really int...I found your comments on mature markets really interesting, because it describes the difference I've seen on the two servers I play on.<br /><br />I made my main a scribe to cash in on the glyph frenzy I knew was coming back in the spring. Just as it was dying down, I found your columns, and used your suggestions to keep a steady 5K a week rolling in as prices fell.<br /><br />I used your columns on transferring servers to bankroll an alt to transfer to another server so I could play with friends there, with no downtime for crafting. (It worked like a charm bringing in 26K so far listing once a day on a lvl 24 with no craft skills - thanks Gevlon!). <br /><br />My main server fits the description of a mature market - we have a lot of sellers using Auctioneer, very competitive pricing, and the same sellers who've been in Inscription since the spring (and so have all the recipes). Since June, I've seen profits fall and level off to about 1.5K a week for about 3 hours of work. I'm happy with that - it's still enough income in minimum time spent to fund my raiding, but it's very evident what a difference it makes once you have 4 or 5 competent sellers in the same market.<br /><br />By contrast, on the new server, I am still selling strong - few sellers, don't seem to be using Auctioneer, listing in goofy ways. I ran into another seller who I regularly undercut, who actually spit on my toon! Pissed he wasn't getting 100G for his special glyphs, but "only 60G" since I came around, "ruining the market." 60G for a glyph it takes 10 seconds to make and he's crying! Oh, wait, he's crying 'cause I'm getting 60 and he's getting 0. With sellers like this, I expect to make money 'til my stash runs out and it's on to the next plan.<br /><br />Thanks for the insights and the advice Gevlon. It's made WOW a lot more fun for me - giving me more time to raid/quest/goof around because I'm NOT grinding and farming.Kulat/Kriyethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09137561138270432380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-55316902633508397862009-08-19T16:06:02.564+02:002009-08-19T16:06:02.564+02:00Good post, showing that a margin of profit is part...Good post, showing that a margin of profit is part of how complicated the gathering/crafting process is as well as the popularity and usefullness of the item.<br /><br />It feels like the more unclear the gathering/crafting process the more margin of profit is to be had.<br /><br />Between me and my g/f's accounts we are only missing Eng (the rest are 450) and we have a herb/alch each. Even though the profit is obvious in making flasks we generally dont make near as much as we do by sending all of our herbs to my inscription alt and I feel that it has to do with the blurry process combined with your ideas.<br /><br />Not every player can make the herb -> ink -> glyph calculation and thus just pays what they feel is right (what they have paid in the past or they really need it and are willing to pay more because hey, u only need it once, until next patch)<br /><br />Also for enchanting months ago dream shards sold so well for the cost of the items we de'd. <br /><br />Where as with alch, its easy to look up the mats and determine that 30g is probably too high.<br /><br />We have determined that our most profitable alts seem to be our JC and Inscriptionist. (though we do most of our own farming of mats unless the AH prices dive low enough)Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01775857444081231155noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-91280900149153125492009-08-19T15:45:29.156+02:002009-08-19T15:45:29.156+02:00Since flask selling is fairly cyclical and attache...Since flask selling is fairly cyclical and attached to raiding schedules, I find it important to pay attention to the common start times and make sure there are plenty posted about 10-15 minutes ahead of those. I.e. 745pm for a 8pm start, and so on. Its not unusual to sell a dozen flasks per minute (mostly endless rage and frost wyrm) as the raids get set. <br /><br />Additionally, the M&S folks do their failpug naxx/OS/uld10 siege raids. Often these are advertised in trade chat. When I see them appearing to be full or near full, I'll head over to the AH and drop a few dozen flasks up and watch them get picked up. <br /><br />It is indeed a very aggressively undercutting market, but there is some gold to be made with little effort. <br /><br />Lastly, I have a few buyers that purchase multiple stacks at a time for their guild runs. Modest discount to auction house prices (partially offset by the savings from not paying the AH fee) helps move stacks and stacks of inventory.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-64071982044760704392009-08-19T15:16:53.952+02:002009-08-19T15:16:53.952+02:00@ Kauzmo:
Does that mean i iwl have to actually sp...@ Kauzmo:<br />Does that mean i iwl have to actually spend time to incrase my proit ?<br />damnit.<br />im not used to that since i leveled inscription...Vlad aerie peaknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-52933179101165450252009-08-19T14:49:32.689+02:002009-08-19T14:49:32.689+02:00"Most of it came from meta gems, a seasonal m..."Most of it came from meta gems, a seasonal market."<br />"it's still more profitable than mindless farming, keep that in mind!"<br />Depends on how much actually comes from metas and epics. At least on my realm potions/elixirs/flask are sold below mats price (due to procs) and Aosoth, as you sad, is Transmutations specced. Any income stats break up Gevlon?GrGnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-74581346035523523852009-08-19T14:24:51.404+02:002009-08-19T14:24:51.404+02:00on of my favorite things to do is to use my potion...on of my favorite things to do is to use my potion master and my scribe together. My scribe needs tons of herbs. So instead of buying adder's tongue wipe out icethorn and lichbloom.<br /><br />Then use some of that to make runic potions. The price goes up because no one makes them. Competition will be low because you'll jack the cost to make up higher and most people don't spec potions.<br /><br />And you will be turning the ink into glyphs so you won't waste your money buying out the resources.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-21252351090063219692009-08-19T14:16:53.798+02:002009-08-19T14:16:53.798+02:00The simple difference between Inscription and and ...The simple difference between Inscription and and any other trade is this:<br /><br />With inscription you are crafting the MAJORITY of your book. Meaning you are posting almost all of the item you know how to craft. No other profession will do that. All of the others are dependent on a select few recipes/item to compete. <br /><br />@Vlad aerie <br />I am sure your email did not get lost in the spam, the nature of your question (around here anyway) is spam. All of the information you need is available to you, you just have to search for it.Kauzmohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13766971722568240302noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-50801664860433452872009-08-19T13:41:38.715+02:002009-08-19T13:41:38.715+02:00I don't understand why you don't need an a...I don't understand why you don't need an addon for either profession (considering the addons we are talking about). The research that is done without the addon could be done just as easily with inscription. I would even argue that Inscription is easier to manage and make profitable without Lil Sparky than Alchemy is.Lee Quillenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00056290327567993215noreply@blogger.com