tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post8597713954087583228..comments2024-02-27T14:44:07.868+01:00Comments on Greedy goblin: Ninja!Gevlonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07072766785893313616noreply@blogger.comBlogger44125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-76739578088997618902011-07-09T09:37:43.447+02:002011-07-09T09:37:43.447+02:00I believe this is more of a staged troll who simpl...I believe this is more of a staged troll who simply seeks a spotlight in your blog Gevlon... yeah some people are like that. But if this is serious then I think he (and his kin) needs to learn one painful truth about the world.<br /><br />"Absolutism ended in medival"<br /><br />His "reasons" and his "justice" or his "needs". Sorry but thats just one side of the medal and it will be only one side of the medal for people who are "relative". Why? because its possible to be so. The very concept of "relativism" negates "absolutism" on sight.<br /><br />To put it simply "I think otherwise".<br /><br />Its pretty painful that this kind of entitled naive absolutism is even tolerated.Dzonatanhttp://dzonatan.deviantart.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-82428907774623563202011-07-06T15:56:59.361+02:002011-07-06T15:56:59.361+02:00I totally agree with the last post and I would lik...I totally agree with the last post and I would like to add that I don't really get why the phrase "lets give them welfare so they don't riot" is in the originale text. Don't think it has anything to do with looting behaviour in WoW.<br />And the Greeks? Well, don't forget the people who lent them too much money are also the people who audited their accounts and the same people who have a large influence on the IMF regarding the conditions for additional loans, in this case massive privatisations, and the same people who can now buy the governement agencies that are begin privatised. They're making money three times in a row and the average Greek sees his future dissolve. I don't see a clear link with a BoE healer item.Malcolm Nixnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-3219000119732575732011-07-02T00:56:12.756+02:002011-07-02T00:56:12.756+02:00Somebody wrote about Greek people not wanting to p...Somebody wrote about Greek people not wanting to pay their debts...I'm not trying to defend them, but I don't believe they have 100% control over their politicians who took all that debt.<br /><br />And 2nd, what about the banks who lent all that money to Greece? If you lent $2000 to a homeless bum at 15% interest, is it realistic to expect getting paid back at all?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-8333252303310727332011-06-29T08:39:41.349+02:002011-06-29T08:39:41.349+02:00Aren't we back at the Prisoner's dilema? Y...Aren't we back at the Prisoner's dilema? You usually don't "ninja" offspec loot with the hope that you can keep the gear that you truly need.Krytusnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-67004106102490856172011-06-29T08:20:19.611+02:002011-06-29T08:20:19.611+02:00>> If he equipped the OH, he'd have this...>> If he equipped the OH, he'd have this achievement. I know this 100% sure since I had this achievement while having an ilvl 346 weapon and an ilvl 359 OH.<br /><br />It doesn't. You need to equip a 359 weapon, not an offhand for the slot to count for cataclysmically epic.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-75750485854565206102011-06-29T02:55:04.844+02:002011-06-29T02:55:04.844+02:00@Ihodael: In this case, with a shadowpriest DD, th...@Ihodael: In this case, with a shadowpriest DD, the need roll was legitimate, as spirit->hit.<br />I'd argue, unfortunately, that whether or not the healer rolled need, both the healer and the shadowpriest were rolling legitimate need and that you breached an implicit social contract even if you aren't a ninja.<br />The contract is:<br />All pugging people have equal chances to get x random gear following a boss kill. (eg, with 5 platewearers, and 4 friends, the tank and healer shouldn't roll need on everything to redistribute to a given dps friend.) Many pugging people make this assumption, and it is reasonable, so being upset when it is violated is reasonable. (mind you, I'd just react by needing tank and healer gear on my paladin...)<br /><br />Now, these implicit contracts are annoying sometimes. But the one I listed is not much more annoying than:<br />Pugging people shall read the boss strategies before showing up.<br /><br />Of course, given the shadowpriest's level of lolspeak, I'm inclined to give you a pass.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-90861570049182644422011-06-29T02:04:09.615+02:002011-06-29T02:04:09.615+02:00The new change that makes boe to bop changes nothi...The new change that makes boe to bop changes nothing if the guy needing it for profit is an Enchanter.<br />He will still be able to DE it and AH it. So...why even bother?Lothildinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13506069263382769785noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-40247302562545682462011-06-29T01:45:14.198+02:002011-06-29T01:45:14.198+02:00I have always thought it was acceptable for everyb...I have always thought it was acceptable for everybody to roll need on boe's. But are'nt you a bit late with this post, it is after all 4.2 now.<br /><br />But having said that I would love to see all items needed under need/greed and lfd be made unable to be disenchanted or vendored. If they want to use it fine. If they are needing because it the last boss and 5g in the hand is > 20% chance of a crystal then tough luck.<br /><br />But after losing the same PARRY item twice in a row to kitty druids I stopped pug tanking again. One guild run a week is enough.Ngitahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13526961657299848611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-79429748875155037692011-06-29T00:21:15.981+02:002011-06-29T00:21:15.981+02:00As an enchanter I see merit in rolling need on all...As an enchanter I see merit in rolling need on all items that I'm eligible for as I can de them all. If nobody else rolled need I'm guaranteed a 100% chance to win the shard...Innohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11855193606152596512noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-70535220098610084992011-06-28T23:03:50.144+02:002011-06-28T23:03:50.144+02:00Why don't they just label the loot? When plat...Why don't they just label the loot? When plate with INT drops everyone knows which class its for. Only allow a need roll for the class it was meant for. Then allow disenchant/sell rolls if they pass.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-30018953143853123562011-06-28T22:12:06.510+02:002011-06-28T22:12:06.510+02:00@Anonymous that posted "If you want to claim ...@Anonymous that posted "If you want to claim you personally think the DD didn't deserve the item and therefore you were an ass to him to prevent the off-hand from going to a moron, that's your choice. But the DD wasn't ninjaing it, you were."<br /><br />I have to disagree about the ninja argument. It was as much an upgrade to him as it was to me (for my healing spec) or for our healer. You believe that waiting for others to roll greed and then rolling need on a BoE without saying a word on it is fair behaviour vs. the other group players? If so then I did nothing worst than him. If you don't consider it fair... then I just got lucky and cut his ruse short. I'm pretty sure that if he had WON the roll... he wouldn't be complaining nor asking the healer if the healer wanted it - and as much as the BoE might be BiS for the spriest it was a clear upgrade for the druid wearing a blue.<br /><br />And like someone else already stated... if he REALLY wanted the BoE for himself (e.g., "I'm a hardcore raider for whom this BoE is BiS and I need the 0.5% performance improvement")... he would have bought already by placing some work on it - the drop chance is so low that working for gold and paying 10k gold for it is better than running instance in the hope it will drop.Ihodael of Darnassusnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-45546607333543709282011-06-28T22:00:47.934+02:002011-06-28T22:00:47.934+02:00@Anonymous that said "If he equipped the OH, ...@Anonymous that said "If he equipped the OH, he'd have this achievement."<br /><br />I checked that also... that made me feel a bit dumb... should have just kept it and sold it since it seems that was what he did anyway.Ihodael of Darnassusnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-80058150826720935052011-06-28T21:20:52.941+02:002011-06-28T21:20:52.941+02:00"As for "Ihodael is a ninja" argume..."As for "Ihodael is a ninja" argument: I rest very much at peace I was not a ninja. I needed to avoid that the dd would ninja it from the healer."<br /><br />It's as good for the DD as it is for the healer. Is the DD a worthless sack of garbage in this case? Yes. Does that suddenly mean he's therefore a ninja? No. Just an incompetent and idiotic player who needed on an item that would be a legitimate upgrade.<br /><br />If you want to claim you personally think the DD didn't deserve the item and therefore you were an ass to him to prevent the off-hand from going to a moron, that's your choice. But the DD wasn't ninjaing it, you were.<br /><br />------------------------<br /><br />"If gold means nothing to you and receiving vendor price is worth pissing off a group of random strangers - you'll hit need."<br /><br />This can already happen. However, hitting need on an item that will sell for 5k+ gold (meaning you average 1000g by rolling greed) to get a guaranteed 150g or to piss off a random person doesn't seem very goblinish, does it? That's anti-social, not asocial.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-67494772986294217092011-06-28T21:18:19.169+02:002011-06-28T21:18:19.169+02:00There's a part of Illodael's story that I ...There's a part of Illodael's story that I don't get:<br /><br />"...I took the time to wait until everyone had rolled: the healer (which was mostly in blues and this was an epic) and the two other dd's rolled greed."<br /><br />The healer in blues rolled greed? Then you tried to "help" by taking it from a player who KNEW that he needed it?<br /><br />How is that not M&S welfare? And coming from PuG member no less. <br /><br />Illodael basically took it upon himself to intervene and redistribute resources based on social feelings.<br /><br />I'm thinking the healer was the true M&S in this scenario. And attempting to boost him was what created the drama.Bristalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11849907713604626977noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-76961871413246543262011-06-28T19:42:34.011+02:002011-06-28T19:42:34.011+02:00One letter was cut off my last link:
http://eu.bat...One letter was cut off my last link:<br />http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/draenor/Madffox/simple<br /><br />And for those replying that there is no BoE healer offhand. There is. It is the one won shown in the armoury link above (like I said, I won it and gave it to the healer).<br /><br />Most likely very very low change of drop... but it dropped: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/item/67149.<br /><br />As for "Ihodael is a ninja" argument: I rest very much at peace I was not a ninja. I needed to avoid that the dd would ninja it from the healer. It worked... and ofc as Gevlon puts it leech dd got upset.<br /><br />Would it all over again (well until tomorrow... then it would be kind of useless unless we can trade the soulbound item to someone else too).Ihodael of Darnassusnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-12587466919741010982011-06-28T18:22:11.324+02:002011-06-28T18:22:11.324+02:00"The only true ninja is the Raid Leader Maste..."The only true ninja is the Raid Leader Master Looter, who kicks the entire raid only to loot the drake mount, gold and all the other goodies for himself infront of every, then ride off into the sunset."<br /><br />No, it is not a necessarily ninja.<br /><br />There are 3 options:<br /><br />1) You don't have a ML, you use Need Before Greed on mounts. Don't like the looting system? Don't join that PuG!<br />2) You do have ML, and no loot rules were stated in /ra at start. Something is given to someone. You have no right to complain.<br />3) You do have ML, loot rules were stated were stated in /ra at start. A) The legendary is reserved B) nothing else is mentioned. The mount is not mentioned. If the legendary drops, the ML has to give it to the person it is reserved to. If the mount drops and it is not rolled according to the loot rules, that ML can and will receive an infraction on their account. Most likely, their account will be banned lifetime.<br /><br />Don't believe me? Go look up the post on the WoW forums. It is there. Search for ninja loot and you will find exactly what I wrote here, and also you will find that anyone who can press need in LFD is not ninjaing anything.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-14415207528383441552011-06-28T18:14:29.811+02:002011-06-28T18:14:29.811+02:00"That said, BoEs are gold, and I feel that ev..."That said, BoEs are gold, and I feel that even the social norm of "everyone roll greed" is silly. Why make the default course of action one in which you can be "stolen from"?"<br /><br />Only partially solved in 4.2. Needing on a BoE will make the item Soulbound rendering it BoP. This still allows for grieving from a single person who can need and then vendor or DE the BoE item.<br /><br />Abolishing need, forcing a social consensus in the group by letting people voluntarily trade or pass on item works much better. But LFD is not social, at all.<br /><br />In the Troll HC I did not find it a big issue regarding the BoE since they were not worth that much. The BoE world drops abuse was bigger (especially by hybrids) because people needed whenever they could on the those expensive BoE items. Some classes are not able to press need. If plate drops, a clothie cannot need on it no matter if it is BoE or BoP. So "everyone press need" works on a maelstrom crystal or a mount, but not on a BoE gear item. This is fixed in 4.2. Not following MS > OS also allows a hybrid to gear up faster at the expense of the non-hybrid since they don't have an OS. That isn't fair, and isn't fixed. I say however: hate the system, not the player.<br /><br />"I wonder how the Blizzard GMs deal with these reports ? He's clearly an imbecile but he's also a paying customer."<br /><br />The same way any customer support deals with such an issue having to tell the customer they won't get what they want: being polite, yet firm. If necessary, repeat what has been said, and then say the decision is final and further discussion is unnecessary.<br /><br />Heartbound Tome http://www.wowhead.com/item=67149/heartbound-tome is perfect for a priest! It has int, spi (= hit for shadow), and mastery. While mastery is not great for shadow, it used to be, and it will be boosted again in 4.2. For disc and holy, mastery is good, and can in this case optionally be reforged to haste (haste is generally better for holy, and shadow, but not disc who stack mastery). A shadow priest, boomkin, or ele shaman who stacks hit instead of spi is a dumbass since Blizzard designed it in such way that spi gives back mana as well as giving hit. If you follow MS > OS the shadow priest has as much right to this item as a druid or priest healer. If you do not follow MS > OS then everyone who can need on it has right to have it, and Idoheal won the item. He is then free to use the item as seeing fit including giving it to a random person.<br /><br />Although the worth of ilvl 359 gear has greatly decreased since 4.2 is coming we can also see that said healer never equipped the OH: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/draenor/Madffox/achievement#92:a5372 shows that he does not have Cataclysmically Epic in weapon. If he equipped the OH, he'd have this achievement. I know this 100% sure since I had this achievement while having an ilvl 346 weapon and an ilvl 359 OH.<br /><br />I've even had specimen who disagreed that they freely DE items. They believed that only they were entitled to enchanting materials because they were enchanter. Anyone else did not need such materials anyway...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-17763079142686042312011-06-28T17:18:35.710+02:002011-06-28T17:18:35.710+02:00The only true ninja is the Raid Leader Master Loot...The only true ninja is the Raid Leader Master Looter, who kicks the entire raid only to loot the drake mount, gold and all the other goodies for himself infront of every, then ride off into the sunset.<br /><br />It doesn't happen often, but usually it is by people who know they are changing realms or something.<br /><br />On the topic though, There is no loot that is yours until it is in your bag.Pickles Johnsonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-45762669469727098402011-06-28T17:12:22.595+02:002011-06-28T17:12:22.595+02:00"Aka, if you actually want to use it you'..."Aka, if you actually want to use it you'll hit need, if you want to sell it you'll hit greed."<br /><br />Or...<br /><br />If gold means nothing to you and receiving vendor price is worth pissing off a group of random strangers - you'll hit need.<br /><br />This is going to be an EPIC change...Dancingbladenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-52580597513868139292011-06-28T16:23:50.500+02:002011-06-28T16:23:50.500+02:00"Declare that everyone greeds on BoE, and don..."Declare that everyone greeds on BoE, and don't roll until others roll. If any of them roll need, roll need too."<br /><br />You realize this leads to everyone waiting until the last second and then hitting need?<br /><br />A 359 BoE dropping in a 346/353 zone is a valid "need" item if it is an upgrade. Unless you're killing Halfus/Ascendant Council, you'll be using a 346 off-hand. I've killed Heroic Halfus a dozen times and have killed Heroic Nefarian...and I'm still using the 359 Halfus off-hand. Sometimes RNG loot sucks.<br /><br />Perhaps more importantly, Blizzard agrees with what I'm saying and disagrees with you about needing on BoEs, which is why they're making rolling "need" on a BoE bind the BoE to you immediately, specifically so you cannot sell it on the AH for gold if you hit "need." Aka, if you actually want to use it you'll hit need, if you want to sell it you'll hit greed.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-69236729632837046292011-06-28T16:06:14.504+02:002011-06-28T16:06:14.504+02:00There is only one offhand dropping in Zul'Guru...There is only one offhand dropping in Zul'Gurub (http://www.wowhead.com/item=69632) and it is BoP.<br />However, it is perfectly legit both for healer and DPS specs of hybrid classed (shadow priest/elemental/moonkin) due to spirit -> hit conversion.<br /><br />Current LFD loot system prevents Needing an item by classes that can't use it. Plate tanks can't need this offhand, but bears can since they can respec to tree/moonkin and use it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-45567152538378655422011-06-28T16:00:08.605+02:002011-06-28T16:00:08.605+02:00While I agree with you that this person was a lol-...While I agree with you that this person was a lol-speaking idiot, and that your guild member is in no way a ninja, the off-hand he is refering to is also usable by shadow priests (or balance druids), since spirit becomes hit to them.<br /><br />He was trying to say, "I needed it for my main spec, your guildie needed it for his off-spec, therefore, I should have gotten it, since I need it more."<br /><br />This is typical social behavior, and utterly absurd. Everyone has as much right to everything that dropped as everyone else in the group. Need does not factor into who deserves what. Did your druid put in as much (or more since he was tanking) effort as the priest? Then he has the same claim to the item as the priest.<br /><br />Notice that the socials response was: "He should have queued as a healer or balance druid if he wanted to roll on it." This is equally absurd. There is a massive tank shortage, so your guildie did the smart thing, and filled a need in the market. If he had queued as something else, this priest would have been waiting longer in the queue and bitched about how there were no tanks. And then he bitches that the tank actually wants and wins something?Cechtnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-35788996084124487242011-06-28T15:57:30.312+02:002011-06-28T15:57:30.312+02:00You should put a bit more effort into understandin...You should put a bit more effort into understanding the concept of 'main spec priority', and the difference between what is legal, and what is ethical.<br /><br />If I did not understand the issue correctly, and the item in question was a healer offhand, being offspec for both a dps and a tank, then of course his accusations are not grounded.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-57823723016540982172011-06-28T15:16:00.859+02:002011-06-28T15:16:00.859+02:00hy do you consider offspec and mainspec to be of s...hy do you consider offspec and mainspec to be of similar priority? I would be angry as well if some feral druid needed on a caster item while a caster also needed it (need as in the roll), not because I am social, but because it would prevent utilization and gear progress where the improvement is the greatest. This is similar to the argument you used when arguing for ninjaing epics from lolarthasDK some time ago: The enchant from the shard will benefit yourself more than the +10 stam and strength it will contribute to a clueless player.<br /><br />As for the "victim" assuming that items cannot be traded cross-realm, well, he is kind of stupid for not knowing that after playing for a while, and whereas your anti-social arguments in this post may be valid, the cause behind this conflict is not necessarily social.Draturg (from Magtheridon project)noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-75920116296269116992011-06-28T15:09:15.384+02:002011-06-28T15:09:15.384+02:00My response is always as follows to these situatio...My response is always as follows to these situations:<br />"If you wanted it, you would already have it."<br /><br />Often followed by a link to opportunity cost on Wikipedia.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com