tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post4116011159994935512..comments2024-02-27T14:44:07.868+01:00Comments on Greedy goblin: Walking in the shoes of the naysayersGevlonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07072766785893313616noreply@blogger.comBlogger43125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-59365810611732716322010-07-07T05:26:07.781+02:002010-07-07T05:26:07.781+02:00Rather impressive you managed to find a group fail...Rather impressive you managed to find a group failing that hard. <br /><br />I try not to expose myself to the "zoo" very often, but of course it's present in every level of raid. I've only just come back to the game so I'm sitting a good 600 gs behind my 10 man guild and I'm discovering a new sensation. Instead of feeling good when I top dps, I feel bad and disappointed because I know that it's my competition that's failing rather than me playing well. <br /><br />Skill > gear.Kariggnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-34966515769279642712010-07-05T08:47:16.400+02:002010-07-05T08:47:16.400+02:00I'm going to be a little more greedy than most...I'm going to be a little more greedy than most that comment here... What the heck do you use for dps chart? I've been looking for an addon just like that for a while.<br /><br />At least since we had a rogue that would do 4K dps in Naxx gear.. until she died in the first 15 seconds from pulling agro and then went AFK the rest of the time and yet would proclaim her "4K DPS lol".Venoymnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-3889983602212623442010-07-01T08:23:33.546+02:002010-07-01T08:23:33.546+02:00Having seen Halion 25 last night on release I want...Having seen Halion 25 last night on release I wanted to add this as well as I feel it matches your existing post.<br /><br />I am a fairly decently geared DK tank. I'm not super awesome - I am still only around 45k, and buff out to around 55k, and 37k armor (70% melee damage reduction.)<br /><br />Having run ICC 25 a lot lately, and having a 20/25% health buff (so around 65-70k HP) plus healers having 20% healing has made people LAZY. This includes myself.<br /><br />Halion showed how lazy. In 3 GCD's I can go from 100% to dead. I don't know why this has happened - but part of me was thinking it was my gear or the healer's gear.<br /><br />It wasn't. It was just bad playing :(Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05493359213693443098noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-19165762471082564552010-07-01T03:59:16.672+02:002010-07-01T03:59:16.672+02:00Just found your blog, starting to wish I had rerol...Just found your blog, starting to wish I had rerolled on your realm for my gold making project.<br /><br />Keep up the good workLouisehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02591533569526154530noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-55779565645381441232010-06-30T22:51:59.148+02:002010-06-30T22:51:59.148+02:00Although with all the gearscore crap going on, the...Although with all the gearscore crap going on, there is one threshold for a person to be truly skilled. Since you cannot hit 6.2K+ gearscrore without a decent amount of 277 ICC hardmode gear, you can safely assume that they are skilled and geared. This is probably the only time I would agree that gearscore does equate to your skill.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-67169782587050035952010-06-30T22:35:53.165+02:002010-06-30T22:35:53.165+02:00Enjoyed this post very much. Getting away from poo...Enjoyed this post very much. Getting away from poor players is part of my motivation in soon starting my own guild. I'm not the best, but part of what makes me good (I think) is that I am TRYING to be a better player. I'm trying to squeeze all I can out of my gear, and my abilities. And frankly, I'm currently in a guild that doesn't have that same goal. They are kind of casual about it - and that's fine. It's just not comfortable. I want to be in a group where I feel comfortable saying "Wait, did you really just say we need a 'zombie kiter' for the Deathwhisper fight?" (happened.) Or, at least a group that will say "No, we are not carrying your alt through this progression fight."<br /><br />/ramble<br /><br /><br />To one commenter about 4k gs and 2k random heroic DPS: You can't compare all DPS classes on this basis. At least, if you are going to, I hope you are looking at boss DPS and not trash. In a random pug, Melee DPS will always drive my caster's DPS into the dirt. I'm not trying to make excuses - just pointing out the facts. Now, if your DPSer is just standing around with a thumb up their bum... <br /><br />"Gearscore" is the worst thing to happen to the game, really. It isn't a reflection of skill at all. I've seen someone in gear far better than mine (Avaryse, Wyrmrest Acord if you wanna look) do far less DPS, soak up far more healing (as a DPS), and just plain... suck.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-57863152233061934072010-06-30T22:07:53.730+02:002010-06-30T22:07:53.730+02:00I'm pretty curious of why do you assume that a...I'm pretty curious of why do you assume that all your naysayers are from terrible guilds used with low standards.Rigorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06793432437568901803noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-388190030767443562010-06-30T21:13:22.503+02:002010-06-30T21:13:22.503+02:00" "Which is the goal of The PuG: havi..." "Which is the goal of The PuG: having a non-moronic player base to gather a group from.<br /><br /> It seems to work."<br /><br /> Yes. That's the main reason for having a guild. You know, people were doing content before "The PuG"."<br /><br />Woosh, over your head goes the point. The majority of guilds don't try to form a "non-moronic player base to gather a group from", they try to form a "non-moronic group with mandatory attendance minimums". There are, as multiple people have already pointed out, other somewhat puggish groups or runs that were already enjoying success in the past. None of those other groups had exactly the same rules as THE PUG, so they don't prove the same points. If you read carefully, you notice how most of those other successful pug-like groups still maintain some formal and informal attendance rewards, instead of trying as hard as the pug does to make each run separate from the prior ones. I expect that THE PUG will eventually develop either formal or informal attendance rewards as well, although probably less than any of their forebears.Kurthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08064568916740238502noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-22339483958242346712010-06-30T19:40:48.542+02:002010-06-30T19:40:48.542+02:00"Which is the goal of The PuG: having a non-m..."Which is the goal of The PuG: having a non-moronic player base to gather a group from.<br /><br />It seems to work."<br /><br />Yes. That's the main reason for having a guild. You know, people were doing content before "The PuG".Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-771580874844818012010-06-30T18:45:56.410+02:002010-06-30T18:45:56.410+02:00@Bobbins: Thanks. I plan on doing the same thing n...@Bobbins: Thanks. I plan on doing the same thing next monday at 18:30.<br /><br />If you want to do some more interesting raids, join The PuG!<br /><br /><br />@Umrtvovacz: I am mainly a Horde player aswell. While in Tree Form, I still pretend to be a tauren. I still run into the Horde quarter in Dalaran.Treestonhttp://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Agamaggan&cn=Treestonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-49081816790627921942010-06-30T17:40:37.911+02:002010-06-30T17:40:37.911+02:00I'm a bit confused...was this a 25-man raid wi...I'm a bit confused...was this a 25-man raid with nothing but The PuG raiders, or was it comprised of trade-recruited people?<br /><br />Regardless, I know the "If only my gear were better..." feeling all too well. I spend most of my raiding time healing, and this is the most common role where "gear fails the player" syndrome occurs. You're in charge of keeping people alive, after all, no matter what. Standing in fires, allowing the boss more swings on the tank because they aren't standing behind the boss, and any other number of common failures shouldn't enter the equation. You are a healer. When they take damage, it's your job to make it go away. If they die, it's YOUR FAULT for not healing them.<br />It sucks...but eventually you get over it once you realize that you went OOM because the people you were healing were either careless in their gear/spec choices, or careless with their raid awareness. Once you realize that Blizzard will NEVER design a fight that cannot be healed through, you lose the guilt.<br /><br />I had a brief exposure to a hardcore raiding guild in TBC and their methods taught me quite a bit about being a responsible member of the raid. <br /><br />Responsibility was knowing the fights, bringing your own consumables, knowing your class/spec, proper gems/enchants, and listening to your raid leader. Even then, that didn't make you qualified to raid...that just put you on the list of people that COULD receive an invite depending on raidcomp needs.<br /><br />I'm no longer in that hardcore guild, nor do I raid all that often. I'm in a strictly casual guild made up of real-life friends and a smattering of friend-of-a-friend people. We'll occasionally raid a 10-man, but most of the time we're left to our own devices if we choose to raid. That means the /trade raids.<br /><br />Nowadays, it seems the only qualifier for being a "good" responsible raider is an achievement link and a high gearscore.<br /><br />My Gearscore is hardly adequate to make it into the "5500 GS+, no scrubs, link achiev" raid recruiting that happens in trade.<br /><br />When I DO raid, I'm usually very depressed that my "undergeared" shaman is so close to the top DPS spots (or healing, depending on the spec I'm needed for) <br />This is in raids with 5800GS+ "elite" players. I'm almost a full 1000 below this score-wise.<br /><br />I suppose the most depressing part isn't that I didn't save the raid because my sub-optimal gear failed me. <br /><br />It's not that I maintain my hit and expertise caps in favor of a small ilevel increase that'd put me below cap, but increase my gearscore.<br /><br />It's not that I could have much greater numbers if I "applied myself" by grinding heroics for the best Emblem gear along with raiding every raid instance every week for upgrades.<br /><br />What truly makes me depressed is that even if I were to work on improving my gear, it would only qualify me to raid with the M&S PuGs from /trade.<br />Gearing up to join the ranks of failures, frustrations, and headaches? How does this make sense? It doesn't...which is why I'm far from concerned with upgrades.<br /><br />I'd rather raid once every 3 weeks and enjoy it than raid 3 times a week and loathe the idiots that I'm grouped with.Slandyrnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-31374805736193854982010-06-30T17:33:13.789+02:002010-06-30T17:33:13.789+02:00I wonder if any of those M&S were also people ...I wonder if any of those M&S were also people who were carried through content at some point, before their guilds realized that they were awful and booted them. You mention that the naysayers are affected by their experiences. I figure that the most obnoxious of the M&S (the "<i>LOL u no skill, 4400 GS is suk</i>") probably got carried through some content and figured that it was pretty easy.<br /><br />So for those players, when things are going badly because they are in a group of players that are just like them, it's not their fault that the raid wipes. It's the <i>other</i> players. <i>He</i> cannot be a bad player, because he beat this content before!Tonushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01082528970434639776noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-28375959794975216432010-06-30T16:42:44.457+02:002010-06-30T16:42:44.457+02:00I wish I was EU...I would join PuG in a heartbeat!...I wish I was EU...I would join PuG in a heartbeat!Imraith Dos Santoshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03302616885968019914noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-85408807512794543412010-06-30T16:42:44.458+02:002010-06-30T16:42:44.458+02:00And now you feel sorrow for your critics? Lol, tru...And now you feel sorrow for your critics? Lol, truly vicious.<br /><br />I looked at some of the dpses and they do not look like 5.5k+ GS but you obviously checked so they were :).<br /><br />Also I liked they way you fought to keep the other 24 alive dispite themselves. Truly epic.<br /><br />On a more serious note the post did seem awfully negative and it is perhaps unfair to compare the pug with an organised guild run. I bet there were many positives with the run as well as negatives. <br />Good going for the raid leader for organising the 25 man event.<br /><br />PS. As you state the raid didn't fail for the lack of gear it was more inexperience/knowledge so why make it an issue. <br />Cough! Undergeared group mention. Cough! Of which you are rightly proud.Bobbinsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-9150109343091529592010-06-30T16:27:49.850+02:002010-06-30T16:27:49.850+02:00Mheh.
The people who first downed Uld did it in 2...Mheh.<br /><br />The people who first downed Uld did it in 200-213 gear.<br /><br />How can anyone in ICC gear fail to roflstomp Uld?<br /><br />Retards who stand in crap and don't review the fight, I guess. I must be spoiled by having competent guildies. If I stand in crap, my healers will let me die and laugh at me. I try not to stand in crap now.<br /><br />Letting screwups die is an act of kindness. They either learn to stop it, or they go away. Or I raise them as Zombie allies, and their DPS goes up.<br /><br />Too bad yer in Europe ... looks like you might be building a competent guild.Kristophrhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08370888276707569365noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-51258145250024184432010-06-30T16:17:06.555+02:002010-06-30T16:17:06.555+02:00Oh how I miss Uld. I'm sold, I'm signing ...Oh how I miss Uld. I'm sold, I'm signing up for EU account and rolling a toon this weekend. Now if only I already had EU account to transfer a toon from.TechDefthttp://www.technicallydeft.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-83329539572595665812010-06-30T16:09:00.419+02:002010-06-30T16:09:00.419+02:00Oh noes! Gevlon has exposed my deep dark secret - ...Oh noes! Gevlon has exposed my deep dark secret - my guild is a bunch of scrubs, no better than a random group pulled out of trade chat. We parade around Dalaran in our emblem gear all day, hoping someone will be impressed, and wipe repeatedly on Basic Campfire. I am so happy he understands my poor plight, and now feels pity instead of resentment, else I would need to run and hide in a corner from the shame of it all.<br /><br />Or perhaps my (incorrect) predictions about Festergut came from looking at Gevlon's own logs. If you go back to the Patchwerk fight, the <i>highest</i> dps was 3300. Against XT, Chopsui did 3700 but most people were below 3000. With a 20% buff, most of the dps was still below 4000 on Festergut. There are a couple of very skilled people in Undergeared who made the Festergut kill possible, but they are the exception, not the rule. Had they not chosen to join, then the naysayers would have been right. Had they been present back at Patchwerk, then the predictions for Festergut probably would have been different.Wilsonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-51999124642205858602010-06-30T15:47:35.572+02:002010-06-30T15:47:35.572+02:00What if I can't get above the M&S?
I am o...What if I can't get above the M&S? <br />I am on grizzly hills-US, one of the worst 8 in the US I believe. We are second worst in our battlegroup, and I would not like to waste money on a transfer. Am I stuck in M&S or is there a way out other than rerolling?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-11124472663890298552010-06-30T15:33:31.865+02:002010-06-30T15:33:31.865+02:00Sometimes, it's useful to return to the shoes ...Sometimes, it's useful to return to the shoes of the "noob", just to see how progressed you have become as a player.<br /><br />But most of the time, it is just a good reminder why you prefer not raiding with them.Denethalhttp://paladinwithin.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-91456211202306675982010-06-30T15:07:57.232+02:002010-06-30T15:07:57.232+02:00Best post you've had in awhile! (imo)
You are...Best post you've had in awhile! (imo)<br /><br />You are absolutely correct about a majority of players simply not realizing how bad their personal and guild's (or pugs) dps is. Being in a high-end guild its become comically typical for new recruits who were accustomed to being in the top 3 of the DPS meters in their old guild to suddenly find themselves ranking somewhere 14th-16th on the meters in our raids!<br /><br />Of course the good ones will improve and learn, the bad ones will usually just disappear...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-39530989260723584322010-06-30T14:55:28.773+02:002010-06-30T14:55:28.773+02:00In my previous guild I was one of the top dps. Co...In my previous guild I was one of the top dps. Constantly one of the top three. By any measure I had available to me at the time, I was a good player and things were going well.<br /><br />That guild disbanded and I moved onto another and I was no longer in the top 3. I was the guy just above tank dps.<br /><br />My first instinct was needing better gear but it was wrong. I needed to learn to play at a higher level.<br /><br />It look time, much more than I would like. But I can now out dps the other mages. I've come to accept that I'll never be top 3 in this guild, but I can compete for 5th.<br /><br />I never would have known however if my previous guild hadn't disbanded and within the next week I bumped into a friend in my current guild who recruited me.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-46694524417608929672010-06-30T14:16:59.081+02:002010-06-30T14:16:59.081+02:00Ulduar is a great raid instance, I agree, and I lo...Ulduar is a great raid instance, I agree, and I love the fact that many of the encounters can't be out-geared even now. It's a great place to weed out the useless people.<br /><br />I recently downloaded GearScore, and I'm quite fond of the Recount plugin it comes with that lists people in order of damge-per-GS.caerphotohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08126464462656422279noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-13013113554057471002010-06-30T14:03:14.027+02:002010-06-30T14:03:14.027+02:00You call members of "The PuG" guildies -...You call members of "The PuG" guildies - yet isn't it part of "The PuG" to disregard the notion of a guildie for raiding?AKA Tha Schusthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05818056339262802919noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-40741911162350474252010-06-30T13:36:03.314+02:002010-06-30T13:36:03.314+02:00"But what if someone has never been in a dece..."But what if someone has never been in a decent guild?"<br /><br />I think this is a very good question, and a reason why pugs are mostly so bad right now. <br />In TBC most people that were interested in PvE were in serious guilds, and they pugged mostly because of spot rotation, or their guild simply focused on other instances this week. I managed to organize pugs that were clearing 5/6 ZA, 2/4 TK and 3/6 SSC, and that was on a server on which only a few guilds killed any bosses in MH or BT. <br />Now much of the content is so easy that people join guilds only for social reasons, and pugs are their main route of progress, and puggers from good guilds are minority.<br /><br />In other words, most of the people that pug now are the same people that have never been in a raid in TBC, or maybe seen a few bosses in kara.<br /><br />That's why I think it's good blizz puts more focus on guilds in cata, cause i believe being forced to do some teamwork with your guild again instead of going straight for pugs will improve the average skill at least a bit. Right now, the game is simply too much solo friendly to expect people to do good when in a team.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461700565722278823.post-24289675648814326402010-06-30T13:21:15.238+02:002010-06-30T13:21:15.238+02:00Interesting Post Gevlon
Although I am somewhat co...Interesting Post Gevlon<br /><br />Although I am somewhat confused about the large amount of emotion you displayed. Also, if I dare say it, your tone was somewhat... Altruistic?<br /><br />Doing ICC10 normal in blues, and LK25 HC with a 5% buff (in gear worse than what most raiders have nowadays) is clearly a demonstration that there are different levels of players. Anyone with access to this information is able to see it.<br /><br />Those who still play with the "LFM 55K GS TOC10 BADGE RUN W ARCHI OR NO INV" are too stupid to find information and realize the logical conclusion - There MUST be players who are better than this, and I shouldn't need to be stuck here with these idiots.<br /><br />Someone who fails to realise this surely is no better than an M&S?Harrumphhttp://wowsanity.blogspot.com/noreply@blogger.com